Evidence for God from Science

Bluejay4 wrote:

RickD wrote:

manden wrote:RickD ,

I do not lie to others , and I do not lie to myself .

And I will not change that . Because the TRUE God likes it .

Jesus Christ is the way, the truth and the life. No one can come to the father(creator), except through Christ.
John 14:6

You going to lay down the ban hammer?

Ahem...already done.

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RE: How did God become man?
by Bluejay4 » Wed Nov 25, 2015 11:55 pm

RE: Okay maybe you guys can help me figure this out/wrap my head around it, how exactly does an infinite being such as God become a mere finite being such as man?

God is omnipotent meaning all powerful. An omnipotent God can both be finite and infinite at the same time. If God were not able to be both then God would not be omnipotent. It is a question of semantics. We really do not comprehend what the word "infinite" means. We only pretend that we know what it means as a representation of something that is beyond our comprehension.

RE: Wouldn't this be like trying to fit an infinite amount of people into a finite amount of rooms?

Your understanding of the word "infinite" is bounded by your finite limitations. Again, an omnipotent being can fit any number of people into any number of rooms by definition.

RE: This isn't even bringing up all the tricky business about not losing any of his divine nature in the process of becoming man, seriously how was Jesus still omnipresent while he was confined to a human body?

It's not tricky at all. It may actually be the other way around. We are divine by nature so nothing is lost in the transformation. I think you are assuming an omnipotent God is bounded by logical consistency. I do not believe that this is the case. For example, an omnipotent God can both be Jesus and omnipresent at the same time. As well as being Jesus and not aware of being omnipresent at the same time. The nature of omnipotence is being both logical possibilities at the same time. An omnipotent God can completely destroyed himself and then bring himself back into existence through the power of omnipotence. Again, what is beyond our comprehension cannot be understood with our limited language. It's not supposed to make any sense at its very core. Faith in God is not going to come from a neatly defined logically consistent argument.

RE: How could he be everywhere? Am I over-thinking this?

An omnipotent God can be everywhere and nowhere at the same time. No, you are not over-thinking. You are thinking which is much worse! Most people pretend to have religion and do not think at all. They idol worship the words of the Bible but for the most part they have very little faith in God.

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Postby manden » Thu Nov 26, 2015 5:00 am

RE: The TRUE God , the real creator of the universe , did not become a man , how you describe it !
We do not know that he ever became a man . That is all nothing but human invention and imagination
( like all religions in the main ) .

Without man God does not exist. God is just a word. God exists in our speaking and written word. So God existing as a man is exactly how it happened. Just saying something is "nothing" doesn't make it something meaningful. It could very well be invention and complete imagination and still be a meaningful and important representation of reality. Logically, it does not have to be one or the other as you seem to presuppose.

RE: Sorry , you are indoctrinated . The bible is NOT the WORD of God ! And in the main human invention and imagination . Prove it with reason and logic !

Everyone chooses to believe some form of indoctrination. You cannot have a meaningful use of language without making certain choices that determine your version of reality. The bible is certainly the word of God because it is about God. I will prove to you God exists without any possible doubt. God is just a word. What the word God means is completely defined by how the word is used in every sentence ever spoken or written. The statement you are really making implicitly is the word God is irrelevant. And that particular judgment is purely subjective and cannot be proven one way or the other. Since you have made your choice there is nothing that can be said that will make your subjective judgment about God any different.

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Postby RickD » Thu Nov 26, 2015 5:17 am
RE: Calling Christians "indoctrinated" because of one of our essential beliefs, will not be tolerated.

This is the wrong approach. You should be able to defend your faith in God and Jesus regardless of what anyone says. manden brings up a standard atheist argument which you should be able to dispatch without much thought. You should not fear what someone says because it may be a threat to your own beliefs. This feeling of fear should be a signal to you that you need to concentrate on what is missing from your own beliefs. If your faith should be strong enough to stand up to any test.

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Postby manden » Thu Nov 26, 2015 6:32 am
RE: I do not lie to others , and I do not lie to myself . And I will not change that . Because the TRUE God likes it .

Having faith is not a lie. You presupposed God is fact that can be validated as truth. Why does it matter if there is no evidence for the existence of God in reality the same way you experience an apple. It makes no difference in our conversation and relationship to what is meaningful in our lives. The essence of faith is assuming God exists and living your life accordingly. The idea that God does not exist and everything in the Universe is just a random pattern of atoms where no pattern is more meaningful than any other is a choice. Claiming everything is meaningless is itself a type of superstition since it is also meaningless that it is meaningless. So if it is all meaningless, and it is also meaningless that it is meaningless, then you might as well just choose meaningful since it makes your mother happy. Faith in God is choice that is made not based on any logical reasons.

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Postby EssentialSacrifice » Thu Nov 26, 2015 6:46 am
RE: This is the place where He exists for all to believe. We really aren't going to listen to another human with his new version of God, as you spoke of earlier. You have made yourself just another man with another idea on God. Quite honestly, you are the culprit who has man-made another version of God and we're not buying it

I think manden's point of view can coexist with your interpretation as well. Everyone who reads the word of God has their own interpretation of what the words mean. Each of us "knows" a correct interpretation when we hear one. However, unless you are God himself reading the word of God nobody really knows which of man's interpretations is the correct one for sure. What I find more interesting is what does it say about your faith in God as indicated by your unwillingness to listen or value another man's idea on God.

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RE: by RickD » Thu Nov 26, 2015 6:48 am
Jesus Christ is the way, the truth and the life. No one can come to the father(creator), except through Christ.
John 14:6

Exodus 20:1-10 And God spoke all these words, saying, “I am the Lord your God, who brought you out of the land of Egypt, out of the house of slavery. “You shall have no other gods before me.“

Sometimes people idol worship Jesus so much they forget about God as the primary part of the equation. For some people I think maybe they should stop being a slave to word Jesus and stick with the word God for a change. When you use and love a word so much it sometimes becomes hollow and meaningless. Faith in God is a way of being where language becomes irrelevant.

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I have no doubt in my faith, am happy to hear a different point of view and I actually like debating different ideas. I even like debating with atheists
I dont think any of the mods mind it either but it does have to be respectful.
Christ IS God so He wouldnt be another god before God.
When I think of, or talk about, God I picture God the Father, Christ the Son, my Saviour or the Holy Spirit or one, two, or all three. Primarily though, the Father, but its through Christ by the grace of the HS.

Not sure if all that makes sense.

Storyteller wrote:I have no doubt in my faith, am happy to hear a different point of view and I actually like debating different ideas. I even like debating with atheists
I dont think any of the mods mind it either but it does have to be respectful.
Christ IS God so He wouldnt be another god before God.
When I think of, or talk about, God I picture God the Father, Christ the Son, my Saviour or the Holy Spirit or one, two, or all three. Primarily though, the Father, but its through Christ by the grace of the HS.

Not sure if all that makes sense.

Well said, you are a good man.

dfnj wrote:

Storyteller wrote:I have no doubt in my faith, am happy to hear a different point of view and I actually like debating different ideas. I even like debating with atheists
I dont think any of the mods mind it either but it does have to be respectful.
Christ IS God so He wouldnt be another god before God.
When I think of, or talk about, God I picture God the Father, Christ the Son, my Saviour or the Holy Spirit or one, two, or all three. Primarily though, the Father, but its through Christ by the grace of the HS.

Not sure if all that makes sense.

Well said, you are a good man.

Why did adam call Eve woman*?
Cos when he first saw her, he was like 'Whoa, man!'



*story t is a whoa man

dfnj wrote:

Storyteller wrote:I have no doubt in my faith, am happy to hear a different point of view and I actually like debating different ideas. I even like debating with atheists
I dont think any of the mods mind it either but it does have to be respectful.
Christ IS God so He wouldnt be another god before God.
When I think of, or talk about, God I picture God the Father, Christ the Son, my Saviour or the Holy Spirit or one, two, or all three. Primarily though, the Father, but its through Christ by the grace of the HS.

Not sure if all that makes sense.

Well said, you are a good man.

Yes she is!!!!

dfnj wrote:
This is the wrong approach. You should be able to defend your faith in God and Jesus regardless of what anyone says. manden brings up a standard atheist argument which you should be able to dispatch without much thought. You should not fear what someone says because it may be a threat to your own beliefs. This feeling of fear should be a signal to you that you need to concentrate on what is missing from your own beliefs. If your faith should be strong enough to stand up to any test.

I don't think you could've misunderstood me any more than you did. You're completely oblivious.

dfnj wrote:

Storyteller wrote:I have no doubt in my faith, am happy to hear a different point of view and I actually like debating different ideas. I even like debating with atheists
I dont think any of the mods mind it either but it does have to be respectful.
Christ IS God so He wouldnt be another god before God.
When I think of, or talk about, God I picture God the Father, Christ the Son, my Saviour or the Holy Spirit or one, two, or all three. Primarily though, the Father, but its through Christ by the grace of the HS.

Not sure if all that makes sense.

Well said, you are a good man.

dfnj wrote:
Sometimes people idol worship Jesus so much they forget about God as the primary part of the equation. For some people I think maybe they should stop being a slave to word Jesus and stick with the word God for a change. When you use and love a word so much it sometimes becomes hollow and meaningless. Faith in God is a way of being where language becomes irrelevant.

People "idol worship Jesus"?

How does one who worships Jesus, who is God, worship an idol?

RickD wrote:People "idol worship Jesus"?
How does one who worships Jesus, who is God, worship an idol?

First, God is God. Second, the teachings of Jesus are more important than the worship of "Jesus". It just seems to me if your primary purpose is to worship Jesus over the teachings of Jesus you are somehow fundamentally missing the point of it all. But hey, worship any way you want. God is your judge not me.

Nessa wrote:

dfnj wrote:

Storyteller wrote:I have no doubt in my faith

Well said, you are a good man.

Why did adam call Eve woman*?
Cos when he first saw her, he was like 'Whoa, man!'
*story t is a whoa man

Sorry for the gender error.

I'm pretty sure God is a woman and here's my logic. Women are just way too damn beautiful for God NOT to be a woman and hence she is the ultimate source of all man's sins. Or, if God is a man, then I'm pretty sure he knew exactly what was going to happen to the apple in the garden with a naked woman prancing about!

dfnj wrote:

Nessa wrote:

dfnj wrote:

Storyteller wrote:I have no doubt in my faith

Well said, you are a good man.

Why did adam call Eve woman*?
Cos when he first saw her, he was like 'Whoa, man!'
*story t is a whoa man

A very wise male wrote:I'm pretty sure God is a woman and here's my logic. Women are just way too damn beautiful for God NOT to be a woman....!

On behalf of all the women who have ever lived, who are are alive, and who are yet to be...

Thanks

dfnj wrote:

RickD wrote:People "idol worship Jesus"?
How does one who worships Jesus, who is God, worship an idol?

First, God is God. Second, the teachings of Jesus are more important than the worship of "Jesus". It just seems to me if your primary purpose is to worship Jesus over the teachings of Jesus you are somehow fundamentally missing the point of it all. But hey, worship any way you want. God is your judge not me.

Isn't following God's teachings, part of worshipping Him?

And second, you didn't address my question. By very definition, one cannot "idolize" God. When one worships an idol, one worships something other than God.

So, Jesus, who is God, cannot be idolized.

Get it?

dfnj wrote:

Nessa wrote:

dfnj wrote:

Storyteller wrote:I have no doubt in my faith

Well said, you are a good man.

Why did adam call Eve woman*?
Cos when he first saw her, he was like 'Whoa, man!'
*story t is a whoa man

Sorry for the gender error.

I'm pretty sure God is a woman and here's my logic. Women are just way too damn beautiful for God NOT to be a woman and hence she is the ultimate source of all man's sins. Or, if God is a man, then I'm pretty sure he knew exactly what was going to happen to the apple in the garden with a naked woman prancing about!

No apology needed. Made me smile.
God is a woman? I love you
Seriously though, I think God is beyond gender. Though not sure, a point to ponder.

For some reason these scriptures come to mind.

1st John 2:22-23 "Who is a liar but he that denieth that Jesus is the Christ?He is anti-christ that denieth the Father and the Son.Whosoever denieth the Son,the same hath not the Father:but he that acknowledgeth the Son hath the Father also."

Philippians 2:9-11 "Wherefore God also hath highly exalted him,and given him a name which is above every name: That at the name of Jesus every knee should bow,of the things in heaven,and things in the earth,and things under the earth;And that every tongue should confess that Jesus Christ is Lord,to the glory of God the Father."