Evidence for God from Science

Stu wrote: ↑Wed May 23, 2018 5:19 amHow can you support gay marriage? The Bible clearly states that marriage is between a man and a women.

How can you not? Gay people are clearly people, and ought to have the same rights as the rest of us, simply because they're people. Beyond that, their marriage is none of your [love] business. That right there is the reason that religion so frequently pisses me off. It's not enough to believe what you believe and live the way that you think you should, you have to take it further and try to impose it on the rest of us.

It's also astounding to me how the same people who get upset about the government butting into their personal lives are all for using the government to butt into their neighbors' personal lives. Is the hypocrisy not apparent?

neo-x wrote: ↑Wed May 23, 2018 7:03 am

Stu wrote: ↑Wed May 23, 2018 5:19 am

neo-x wrote: ↑Wed May 23, 2018 5:11 am I think Mel's point is that the same way other laws are now invalid so is the one against Hs. The same way people don't consider divorce or some other sin as abominable anymore. Issues like these weren't the focus of the authors.

That being said, while I support gay marriage and rights, I think to make a case for hs from the Bible is very weak. It's quite clear that the scriptures consider it a sin. Although the gospels are quiet about it, Paul isn't.

And Phil, all sin is a matter of deeper heart issue. So don't single this one out.

How can you support gay marriage? The Bible clearly states that marriage is between a man and a women.

Mark 10:9 King James Version (KJV)
9 What therefore God hath joined together, let not man put asunder.

What therefore God hath joined together... It clearly says what God has joined together - do you think God is going to join two men together knowing that they will more than likely commit sodomy.

My reasons are different from religion. I live in a country where I am marginalized and I don't have equal rights. And I can see the underlying logic that denies me mine based on a religion. So I disagree in principle with laws that have to be enforced on people because they don't support the enforced religion and that is why I support it.

Yet you call yourself a Christian - so you pick and choose what parts of the Bible you agree and don't agree with?
Essentially the Bible is wrong on occasion?

Its basic human decency to support the rights of your fellow citizens.

If they are sinning (like the rest of us) let God question them. I will support them because I think it's the right thing to do.

It astounds me that you didn't consider the reason I gave. To me it makes perfect sense. Do not do to others what you don't want others to do to you.

edwardmurphy wrote: ↑Wed May 23, 2018 7:04 am

Stu wrote: ↑Wed May 23, 2018 5:19 amHow can you support gay marriage? The Bible clearly states that marriage is between a man and a women.

How can you not? Gay people are clearly people, and ought to have the same rights as the rest of us, simply because they're people. Beyond that, their marriage is none of your [love] business. That right there is the reason that religion so frequently pisses me off. It's not enough to believe what you believe and live the way that you think you should, you have to take it further and try to impose it on the rest of us.

It's also astounding to me how the same people who get upset about the government butting into their personal lives are all for using the government to butt into their neighbors' personal lives. Is the hypocrisy not apparent?

No, gays are attempting to hijack marriage! It is a christian institution.
By all means have a civil union if you want that, but don't attempt to rewrite the Bible or the Christian faith.

If you don't like the fact that the Bible says that marriage is only between a man and a women then start your own religion or join one that does allow it, don't attempt to change the Christian faith to suit you.

God says that it is so, not man.

By the way# why do you just simply jump to attack my belief that I am a Christian just because I support civil rights?
A lobg jump if you ask me.

Stu wrote: ↑Wed May 23, 2018 7:18 am

edwardmurphy wrote: ↑Wed May 23, 2018 7:04 am

Stu wrote: ↑Wed May 23, 2018 5:19 amHow can you support gay marriage? The Bible clearly states that marriage is between a man and a women.

How can you not? Gay people are clearly people, and ought to have the same rights as the rest of us, simply because they're people. Beyond that, their marriage is none of your [love] business. That right there is the reason that religion so frequently pisses me off. It's not enough to believe what you believe and live the way that you think you should, you have to take it further and try to impose it on the rest of us.

It's also astounding to me how the same people who get upset about the government butting into their personal lives are all for using the government to butt into their neighbors' personal lives. Is the hypocrisy not apparent?

No, gays are attempting to hijack marriage! It is a christian institution.
By all means have a civil union if you want that, but don't attempt to rewrite the Bible or the Christian faith.

If you don't like the fact that the Bible says that marriage is only between a man and a women then start your own religion or join one that does allow it, don't attempt to change the Christian faith to suit you.

God says that it is so, not man.

That is the same logic Muslims apply.

neo-x wrote: ↑Wed May 23, 2018 7:15 am Its basic human decency to support the rights of your fellow citizens.

If they are sinning (like the rest of us) let God question them. I will support them because I think it's the right thing to do.

It astounds me that you didn't consider the reason I gave. To me it makes perfect sense. Do not do to others what you don't want others to do to you.

Sorry but you can make all the excuses you want. Essentially you are saying God is wrong and you are right.
You can throw the Bible away while you are at it, or at least tear out all the pages that YOU happen to disagree with.

You have placed man's (your) law above God's law.

And I'm not some nasty Christian either, I'm just not letting my feelings make my decisions for me, rather I follow the Bible.

neo-x wrote: ↑Wed May 23, 2018 7:20 am

Stu wrote: ↑Wed May 23, 2018 7:18 am

edwardmurphy wrote: ↑Wed May 23, 2018 7:04 am

Stu wrote: ↑Wed May 23, 2018 5:19 amHow can you support gay marriage? The Bible clearly states that marriage is between a man and a women.

How can you not? Gay people are clearly people, and ought to have the same rights as the rest of us, simply because they're people. Beyond that, their marriage is none of your [love] business. That right there is the reason that religion so frequently pisses me off. It's not enough to believe what you believe and live the way that you think you should, you have to take it further and try to impose it on the rest of us.

It's also astounding to me how the same people who get upset about the government butting into their personal lives are all for using the government to butt into their neighbors' personal lives. Is the hypocrisy not apparent?

No, gays are attempting to hijack marriage! It is a christian institution.
By all means have a civil union if you want that, but don't attempt to rewrite the Bible or the Christian faith.

If you don't like the fact that the Bible says that marriage is only between a man and a women then start your own religion or join one that does allow it, don't attempt to change the Christian faith to suit you.

God says that it is so, not man.

That is the same logic Muslims apply.

I don't care what Muslims think. I care what the Bible says.

Stu wrote: ↑Wed May 23, 2018 7:23 am

neo-x wrote: ↑Wed May 23, 2018 7:20 am

Stu wrote: ↑Wed May 23, 2018 7:18 am

edwardmurphy wrote: ↑Wed May 23, 2018 7:04 am

Stu wrote: ↑Wed May 23, 2018 5:19 amHow can you support gay marriage? The Bible clearly states that marriage is between a man and a women.

How can you not? Gay people are clearly people, and ought to have the same rights as the rest of us, simply because they're people. Beyond that, their marriage is none of your [love] business. That right there is the reason that religion so frequently pisses me off. It's not enough to believe what you believe and live the way that you think you should, you have to take it further and try to impose it on the rest of us.

It's also astounding to me how the same people who get upset about the government butting into their personal lives are all for using the government to butt into their neighbors' personal lives. Is the hypocrisy not apparent?

No, gays are attempting to hijack marriage! It is a christian institution.
By all means have a civil union if you want that, but don't attempt to rewrite the Bible or the Christian faith.

If you don't like the fact that the Bible says that marriage is only between a man and a women then start your own religion or join one that does allow it, don't attempt to change the Christian faith to suit you.

God says that it is so, not man.

That is the same logic Muslims apply.

I don't care what Muslims think. I care what the Bible says.

That is exactly what they say about their book. And the logic is hard to deny. Essentially that makes me a marginalized person in their society.

Don't you see the obvious problem? We can't let religion decide rights of people.

Stu wrote: ↑Wed May 23, 2018 7:22 am

neo-x wrote: ↑Wed May 23, 2018 7:15 am Its basic human decency to support the rights of your fellow citizens.

If they are sinning (like the rest of us) let God question them. I will support them because I think it's the right thing to do.

It astounds me that you didn't consider the reason I gave. To me it makes perfect sense. Do not do to others what you don't want others to do to you.

Sorry but you can make all the excuses you want. Essentially you are saying God is wrong and you are right.
You can throw the Bible away while you are at it, or at least tear out all the pages that YOU happen to disagree with.

You have placed man's (your) law above God's law.

And I'm not some nasty Christian either, I'm just not letting my feelings make my decisions for me, rather I follow the Bible.

I am not justifying myself to you. This is what I believe, Sincerely. Amd you're right, I probably will throw out my Bible in the trash can# i have already tore out half of the pages.


And your feelings are coming off quite strong even if you have gone Nosedeaf to it.

Stu wrote: ↑Wed May 23, 2018 7:18 am

edwardmurphy wrote: ↑Wed May 23, 2018 7:04 am

Stu wrote: ↑Wed May 23, 2018 5:19 amHow can you support gay marriage? The Bible clearly states that marriage is between a man and a women.

How can you not? Gay people are clearly people, and ought to have the same rights as the rest of us, simply because they're people. Beyond that, their marriage is none of your [love] business. That right there is the reason that religion so frequently pisses me off. It's not enough to believe what you believe and live the way that you think you should, you have to take it further and try to impose it on the rest of us.

It's also astounding to me how the same people who get upset about the government butting into their personal lives are all for using the government to butt into their neighbors' personal lives. Is the hypocrisy not apparent?

No, gays are attempting to hijack marriage! It is a christian institution.
By all means have a civil union if you want that, but don't attempt to rewrite the Bible or the Christian faith.

If you don't like the fact that the Bible says that marriage is only between a man and a women then start your own religion or join one that does allow it, don't attempt to change the Christian faith to suit you.

God says that it is so, not man.

I'm assuming by 'marriage' Ed means a civil union as a 'religious' marriage wouldn't mean much to him.

On that basis, let me ask you a question, Ed, are you (and by you I mean society in general) really prepared to accept the ramifications of same sex civil unions? And before you ask, here are but a few:

- Institutionally enforced genderless identities (already started at the federal level in Canada)
- Many persons' civil unions (3 or more) (already advocated for by poly-amorous groups)

The fact is if you advocate for same sex civil unions then you must also advocate for the above, otherwise you'd just be a hypocrite.

This will will inevitably lead to a complete rewrite of family and estate law (wills, living trusts, health proxies, and so on), income and taxation, marital law, etc. etc. etc.

You might call that progress, I don't know. I call it the complete annihilation of any semblance of family and with it civilization as we know it. It is a new dawn of the planet of the lost.

Byblos wrote: ↑Wed May 23, 2018 7:33 am The fact is if you advocate for same sex civil unions then you must also advocate for the above, otherwise you'd just be a hypocrite.

Do we agree that according to scripture ( and therefore according to God ) that homosexuality is wrong? ( the acts ).

If so, then we know God's position on the matter, YET...

YET God allows humans to act how they will. ( that's not to say there is no consequence )

Does God then "advocate" for same sex civil unions and therefore is He a hypocrite?
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Stu wrote: ↑Wed May 23, 2018 7:23 am

neo-x wrote: ↑Wed May 23, 2018 7:20 am

Stu wrote: ↑Wed May 23, 2018 7:18 am

edwardmurphy wrote: ↑Wed May 23, 2018 7:04 am

Stu wrote: ↑Wed May 23, 2018 5:19 amHow can you support gay marriage? The Bible clearly states that marriage is between a man and a women.

How can you not? Gay people are clearly people, and ought to have the same rights as the rest of us, simply because they're people. Beyond that, their marriage is none of your [love] business. That right there is the reason that religion so frequently pisses me off. It's not enough to believe what you believe and live the way that you think you should, you have to take it further and try to impose it on the rest of us.

It's also astounding to me how the same people who get upset about the government butting into their personal lives are all for using the government to butt into their neighbors' personal lives. Is the hypocrisy not apparent?

No, gays are attempting to hijack marriage! It is a christian institution.
By all means have a civil union if you want that, but don't attempt to rewrite the Bible or the Christian faith.

If you don't like the fact that the Bible says that marriage is only between a man and a women then start your own religion or join one that does allow it, don't attempt to change the Christian faith to suit you.

God says that it is so, not man.

That is the same logic Muslims apply.

I don't care what Muslims think. I care what the Bible says.

It amazes me that your conviction to follow the bible to the letter overides all things.

It pains me to make this analogy but had lived in old testament times you would have found God's commands a little bit trickier. For instance you would have been obliged to kill preachers of other religions, stone the prostitute, burn the witch, kill the sabbath breaker. These were God's commands. And what the Bible says and Israel was commanded to carry these out.

Do you think you would apply the same logic still?

BavarianWheels wrote: ↑Wed May 23, 2018 7:44 am

Byblos wrote: ↑Wed May 23, 2018 7:33 am The fact is if you advocate for same sex civil unions then you must also advocate for the above, otherwise you'd just be a hypocrite.

Do we agree that according to scripture ( and therefore according to God ) that homosexuality is wrong? ( the acts ).

If so, then we know God's position on the matter, YET...

YET God allows humans to act how they will. ( that's not to say there is no consequence )

Does God then "advocate" for same sex civil unions and therefore is He a hypocrite?
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Bav, I have not the slightest clue what you're talking about (assuming this was meant for me, since you're quoting me).

Byblos wrote: ↑Wed May 23, 2018 7:53 am

BavarianWheels wrote: ↑Wed May 23, 2018 7:44 am

Byblos wrote: ↑Wed May 23, 2018 7:33 am The fact is if you advocate for same sex civil unions then you must also advocate for the above, otherwise you'd just be a hypocrite.

Do we agree that according to scripture ( and therefore according to God ) that homosexuality is wrong? ( the acts ).

If so, then we know God's position on the matter, YET...

YET God allows humans to act how they will. ( that's not to say there is no consequence )

Does God then "advocate" for same sex civil unions and therefore is He a hypocrite?
.
.

Bav, I have not the slightest clue what you're talking about (assuming this was meant for me, since you're quoting me).

I'm simply asking if you think God is a hypocrite for allowing that which He says is wrong?
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