@ Gman
after attending a messianic congregation it opened my mind up to so much. the way the rabbai/pastor taught was unlike anything i have ever heard. i always knew there was more to God's word than what i was taught or thought. since then i have been able to dive deeper and deeper into His word and understand it so much more. i thank God for showing me the things He has i agree it really does bring the bible to a geeky level
Our rightousness is of filthy rags and in the eyes of God all have gone astray and nobody is justified under the Law. We are saved by the Grace of God through our faith in Him and in Him who he has sent Jesus Christ alone. There is no other way.
Ivellious wrote:But Rick, both your description and Protestant's both mean that Christians and Jews don't worship the same God. The Jewish God is Unitarian and has no son either. Yet, most Christians won't hesitate to tell you that they worship the same God as the Jews.
Personally I'd say that Paul is closest to my belief; that Jews, Christians, and Muslims worship the same God, albeit in greatly differing ways and with different understandings.
Well, worship the same God is a bit of a stretch...that their religions have, as their Deity, the original God of Abraham, yes of course.
But that is where it ends because HOW the worship and WHAT they worship is not the same.
Trinity thing aside, the Hebrew God and Islamic God is far more "the same" than the Christian God because of what he demands and gives Us.
Allah and Yahweh are more "works oriented" while the Christian God revealed in Christ is a giver of grace, of forgiveness and salvation.
Allah and Yahweh are "unattainable" to their worshipers, The God of Christians become MAN so that we could attain Him.
IMO, Yahweh became Our Father via Christs complete and correct revelation of Him and only be being a christian cna we understand Yahweh as Christ has revealed Him but to do that we must accept Christ, those that don't accept Christ "get" the OT Yahweh/ Allah.
i have to say that i don't agree with you on this paul. you seem to be separating chrsitans and hebrews when we are all grafted together and worship the same God the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob. You seem to paint God as works oriented in the OT when he was always the God of forgiveness, salvation and grace. The hebrew people are our brothers and sisters and although as a collective they may not believe Yeshua as messiah they do believe in the messiah which as we speak more and more hebrews are starting see Him as that. I just hate seeing people separate christians and hebrews as if they have been replaced by us when in fact we are all brothers and sisters. it does sadden me to read stuff like this from fellow brothers. Allah is not the same as the God of the hebrews (which is our God too) he just isn't and i can't believe you actually said that.
I am not sepearating Christians and Hebrews or Islamics for that matter, I made it clear that they have the same God ( there is only ONE God).
My point is they worship that God under a different understanding of what that God IS and Wants.
It's not about Jesus ( or Yeshua if you perfer) being recognized as the Messiah, but about the Christian understanding of the Triune Godhead.
Muslims view themselves as decendents of Abraham and they wroship the same God as the Hebrew BUT HOW they worship that God is based on the teachings of Mohamed and as such, they view that THEY are the ones with the correct understanding of WHO God is and WHAT he wants from us and HOW to worship Him.
@ paul
im sorry man but please do the research for yourself. islam doesn't worship the same god as the christian and hebrew God. as B.W. stated the god of islam is a babylonian moon god. do the research yourself and you'll see.
Our rightousness is of filthy rags and in the eyes of God all have gone astray and nobody is justified under the Law. We are saved by the Grace of God through our faith in Him and in Him who he has sent Jesus Christ alone. There is no other way.
Zionist wrote:@ paul
im sorry man but please do the research for yourself. islam doesn't worship the same god as the christian and hebrew God. as B.W. stated the god of islam is a babylonian moon god. do the research yourself and you'll see.
PaulSacramento wrote:
I am not sepearating Christians and Hebrews or Islamics for that matter, I made it clear that they have the same God ( there is only ONE God).
My point is they worship that God under a different understanding of what that God IS and Wants.
It's not about Jesus ( or Yeshua if you perfer) being recognized as the Messiah, but about the Christian understanding of the Triune Godhead.
Muslims view themselves as decendents of Abraham and they wroship the same God as the Hebrew BUT HOW they worship that God is based on the teachings of Mohamed and as such, they view that THEY are the ones with the correct understanding of WHO God is and WHAT he wants from us and HOW to worship Him.
Wow.. This is completely off base.. Muslim's most certainly worship a different god. Muslim's worship a god dreamed up by mohammad from a dark cave. This god is ultimate replacement theology where it supersedes everything before it, including the last words of Yeshua. It is not the G-d of love or the Bible. It is a god of destruction. Muslims are Abraham's descendents, true, and they will triumph under the true G-d of Abraham and Jacob in the future. Not under Esau.
The heart cannot rejoice in what the mind rejects as false - Galileo
We learn from history that we do not learn from history - Georg Friedrich Wilhelm Hegel
Finally, brothers, whatever is true, whatever is noble, whatever is right, whatever is pure, whatever is lovely, whatever is admirable, if anything is excellent or praiseworthy, think about such things. -Philippians 4:8
PaulSacramento wrote:I am not sepearating Christians and Hebrews or Islamics for that matter, I made it clear that they have the same God ( there is only ONE God).
My point is they worship that God under a different understanding of what that God IS and Wants.
It's not about Jesus ( or Yeshua if you perfer) being recognized as the Messiah, but about the Christian understanding of the Triune Godhead.
Muslims view themselves as decendents of Abraham and they wroship the same God as the Hebrew BUT HOW they worship that God is based on the teachings of Mohamed and as such, they view that THEY are the ones with the correct understanding of WHO God is and WHAT he wants from us and HOW to worship Him.
I agree with Paul.
Proinsias wrote:I don't think you are hearing me. Preference for ice cream is a moral issue
And that, brothers and sisters, is the kind of foolishness you get people who insist on denying biblical theism. A good illustration of any as the length people will go to avoid acknowledging basic truths.
PaulSacramento wrote:I am not sepearating Christians and Hebrews or Islamics for that matter, I made it clear that they have the same God ( there is only ONE God).
My point is they worship that God under a different understanding of what that God IS and Wants.
It's not about Jesus ( or Yeshua if you perfer) being recognized as the Messiah, but about the Christian understanding of the Triune Godhead.
Muslims view themselves as decendents of Abraham and they wroship the same God as the Hebrew BUT HOW they worship that God is based on the teachings of Mohamed and as such, they view that THEY are the ones with the correct understanding of WHO God is and WHAT he wants from us and HOW to worship Him.
I agree with Paul.
Yes.. Well we already knew you worshiped the god of the koran..
The heart cannot rejoice in what the mind rejects as false - Galileo
We learn from history that we do not learn from history - Georg Friedrich Wilhelm Hegel
Finally, brothers, whatever is true, whatever is noble, whatever is right, whatever is pure, whatever is lovely, whatever is admirable, if anything is excellent or praiseworthy, think about such things. -Philippians 4:8
PaulSacramento wrote:
I am not sepearating Christians and Hebrews or Islamics for that matter, I made it clear that they have the same God ( there is only ONE God).
My point is they worship that God under a different understanding of what that God IS and Wants.
It's not about Jesus ( or Yeshua if you perfer) being recognized as the Messiah, but about the Christian understanding of the Triune Godhead.
Muslims view themselves as decendents of Abraham and they wroship the same God as the Hebrew BUT HOW they worship that God is based on the teachings of Mohamed and as such, they view that THEY are the ones with the correct understanding of WHO God is and WHAT he wants from us and HOW to worship Him.
Wow.. This is completely off base.. Muslim's most certainly worship a different god. Muslim's worship a god dreamed up by mohammad from a dark cave. This god is ultimate replacement theology where it supersedes everything before it, including the last words of Yeshua. It is not the G-d of love or the Bible. It is a god of destruction. Muslims are Abraham's descendents, true, and they will triumph under the true G-d of Abraham and Jacob in the future. Not under Esau.
Nonsense.. Of course they are going to want you to believe that their god is the G-d of the Bible. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure that out. Their god is not the G-d the Bible. Buy a koran and read it. They don't even know what it is they worship.
The heart cannot rejoice in what the mind rejects as false - Galileo
We learn from history that we do not learn from history - Georg Friedrich Wilhelm Hegel
Finally, brothers, whatever is true, whatever is noble, whatever is right, whatever is pure, whatever is lovely, whatever is admirable, if anything is excellent or praiseworthy, think about such things. -Philippians 4:8
@ paul
Gman is right and if i were you i would do some more research on the matter. did you know that Allah has the titles "Allah the wicked" and "Allah the great deceiver"? those names should be proof alone to you that Allah is not YHWH. those names should be instant red flag for any believer out there.
Our rightousness is of filthy rags and in the eyes of God all have gone astray and nobody is justified under the Law. We are saved by the Grace of God through our faith in Him and in Him who he has sent Jesus Christ alone. There is no other way.
Who gave Allah such titles? I could easily give the Christian God the title "The Great Annihilator of Cities" but that does not make it a proper title.
lol it's in the koran ivellious go read it for yourself and you'd be wrong to give God titles such as that. the correct title to give God for that would be righteous judge but obviously i already know you wouldn't agree with that. there are so many contradictions in the koran and especially when compared to the bible that you can easily see the god of Islam is not the same as the God of the bible. as a matter of fact i thought i asked you questions that you have yet to answer and probably haven't researched yet either. so please don't post til you can approach the discussion with some educated responses. thanks.
Our rightousness is of filthy rags and in the eyes of God all have gone astray and nobody is justified under the Law. We are saved by the Grace of God through our faith in Him and in Him who he has sent Jesus Christ alone. There is no other way.
Nonsense.. Of course they are going to want you to believe that their god is the G-d of the Bible. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure that out. Their god is not the G-d the Bible. Buy a koran and read it. They don't even know what it is they worship.
Similar arguments have been put forth VS Christianity.
Nonsense.. Of course they are going to want you to believe that their god is the G-d of the Bible. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure that out. Their god is not the G-d the Bible. Buy a koran and read it. They don't even know what it is they worship.
Similar arguments have been put forth VS Christianity.
Paul, must you always play the role of Devil's Advocate?
John 5:24 24 “Truly, truly, I say to you, he who hears My word, and believes Him who sent Me, has eternal life, and does not come into judgment, but has passed out of death into life.
“A nation of sheep will beget a government of wolves.”
-Edward R Murrow
St. Richard the Sarcastic--The Patron Saint of Irony
i agree it really does bring the bible to a geeky level 
