Evidence for God from Science

edwardmurphy wrote: ↑Wed Feb 12, 2020 9:00 pm

Byblos wrote: ↑Wed Feb 12, 2020 3:48 pmOf course, you and Ed don't agree with it, it must be a Russian outfit. Whatever,

RT is a Russian outfit because it's owned by the Russian government. That's not a difficult claim to fact check.

Ed, he wasn't referring to RT, he was responding to my fair and balanced comment, i.e. Fox News.

edwardmurphy wrote: ↑Wed Feb 12, 2020 9:00 pm

Byblos wrote: ↑Wed Feb 12, 2020 3:48 pmDude, you do know you sound leftier than Ed, don't you? If that were even possible.

I don't even know how to respond to this stuff anymore. It's like you're in a war against reality.

It was a joke man, chill. I am well aware you're a self-described 1956 Republican.

Byblos wrote: ↑Wed Feb 12, 2020 9:34 pm

edwardmurphy wrote: ↑Wed Feb 12, 2020 9:00 pm

Byblos wrote: ↑Wed Feb 12, 2020 3:48 pmOf course, you and Ed don't agree with it, it must be a Russian outfit. Whatever,

RT is a Russian outfit because it's owned by the Russian government. That's not a difficult claim to fact check.

Ed, he wasn't referring to RT, he was responding to my fair and balanced comment, i.e. Fox News.

edwardmurphy wrote: ↑Wed Feb 12, 2020 9:00 pm

Byblos wrote: ↑Wed Feb 12, 2020 3:48 pmDude, you do know you sound leftier than Ed, don't you? If that were even possible.

I don't even know how to respond to this stuff anymore. It's like you're in a war against reality.

It was a joke man, chill. I am well aware you're a self-described 1956 Republican.

Funny, he spouts all the Democratic talking points to a tee (and he says that AOC is the future of the Democratic party), so one could easily "mistake" him for a leftist. If it quacks like a duck and all that.

DBowling wrote: ↑Thu Feb 06, 2020 10:56 am

RickD wrote: ↑Thu Feb 06, 2020 10:34 am I wonder how much money this sham cost the taxpayers.

Well the National Debt has increased by over $3 Trillion dollars over the last three years.
Is that the sham you are referring to?

The rich globalists are going to eat it too,not America or the American people.It does not matter how much money Trump spends cause the Federal reserve will just print more money then at the right time the whole system is going to collapse as we tansition to a Gold backed economy.This is why Trump is making trade deals,he is getting things ready.Notice Trump is in India - trade deal,plus to show China we have other trading partners and do not have to just rely on them,- strategy - The Art of the Deal.

Oh Abe, you poor, naive sap. That's not how it works. That's not how any of it works.

edwardmurphy wrote: ↑Tue Mar 03, 2020 10:42 am Oh Abe, you poor, naive sap. That's not how it works. That's not how any of it works.

You're still stuck in the "Democrat good-Republican bad lesser than two evil" political game.We've done moved on from that and doing things the wrong way no matter which party is in power.Our agenda is totally new and puts America and the American people first.

Based on the plans that Abe has laid out in his last couple posts it appears that the President has the globalists right where he wants them. Strange that he seems so unhappy about it though.

In the real world the President went on TV last night to talk about the coronavirus and the economy. His job was to read a short, prepared speech off the teleprompter, explaining that he had it under control and that we'd all be just fine. Instead he ad libbed and screwed it up so comprehensively that he caused a panic and finally broke the growing economy that Obama handed him. The Dow Jones lost 2,352 points today, and all of the other indices tanked just as badly. All told the Dow has lost nearly 8,000 points in the last 30 days. That's about a 27% drop. If tomorrow is anything like today we'll have completely lost all of the gains made during the entirety of Trump's Presidency in a single month.

Anyone else horrified?

Edwardmurphy wrote:
Trump blah blah blah. I love Obama Trump sucks blah blah blah...
Anyone else horrified?

What’s weird is that when I trust in Christ, I really don’t get “horrified” by all of this.
Funny how that works.

The President has consistently insisted that Obama gave him a garbage economy and that he gets complete credit for all gains since he took office. If he gets the credit for the gains then he gets the blame when all of those gains melt away amid fears that he's incapable of leading us through a crisis and is most likely making it worse with his incompetent bumbling.

If God's plan is to put an stupid, narcissistic buffoon in charge during a pandemic then he's a ****ty planner, and if your serenity leads you to sit back and trust that things are just how they should be then please do the rest of us a favor and stop voting. That way those of us who think that life matters more than afterlife can run the country in a way that works for us, and you heaven bound transients don't need to worry yourselves about it.

edwardmurphy wrote: ↑Fri Mar 13, 2020 5:22 am The President has consistently insisted that Obama gave him a garbage economy and that he gets complete credit for all gains since he took office. If he gets the credit for the gains then he gets the blame when all of those gains melt away amid fears that he's incapable of leading us through a crisis and is most likely making it worse with his incompetent bumbling.

If God's plan is to put an stupid, narcissistic buffoon in charge during a pandemic then he's a ****ty planner, and if your serenity leads you to sit back and trust that things are just how they should be then please do the rest of us a favor and stop voting. That way those of us who think that life matters more than afterlife can run the country in a way that works for us, and you heaven bound transients don't need to worry yourselves about it.

Wow! Your true colors are shining brighter than the sun and yet you are immersed in blinding darkness.

Byblos wrote: ↑Fri Mar 13, 2020 6:47 amWow! Your true colors are shining brighter than the sun

Spare me the pearl clutching. I sometimes wish that people who make their decisions based largely on what I regard as superstition would opt out of the political process, and on occasion I even forget myself and blurt it out, but I also support politicians who want to make it easier for all of my fellow citizens to exercise their right to vote, whether I agree with their politics or not. You, meanwhile, support the party that been all in on voter suppression or the last couple of decades.

Byblos wrote: ↑Fri Mar 13, 2020 6:47 amand yet you are immersed in blinding darkness.

Right back atcha, buddy.

edwardmurphy wrote: ↑Fri Mar 13, 2020 7:14 am

Byblos wrote: ↑Fri Mar 13, 2020 6:47 amWow! Your true colors are shining brighter than the sun

Spare me the pearl clutching. I sometimes wish that people who make their decisions based largely on what I regard as superstition would opt out of the political process, and on occasion I even forget myself and blurt it out, but I also support politicians who want to make it easier for all of my fellow citizens to exercise their right to vote, whether I agree with their politics or not. You, meanwhile, support the party that been all in on voter suppression or the last couple of decades.

Byblos wrote: ↑Fri Mar 13, 2020 6:47 amand yet you are immersed in blinding darkness.

Right back atcha, buddy.

In most of my interactions, whether with you (mainly about politics), or with other atheists about the existence of God, not once did I directly reference God, the Bible, or faith. NOT ONCE. I challenge you to go find a single quote. I pride myself in using well thought-out, rational arguments based in facts. This is not a case of misinformation, you're nothing but a phony 2-bit leftist hack who is deliberately spreading lies and who just exposed himself for who he truly is. You ought to be ashamed of yourself. But I will keep praying for you nonetheless.

Ed: I sometimes wish that people who make their decisions based largely on what I regard as superstition would opt out of the political process...

What I call the epitome of superstition is the belief of those like Ed, whom believe that just the right, astounding things appeared and then IMMEDIATELY begin assembling themselves into complex universe, when, moments before, nothing physically existed, and that the many astoundingly complex requirements / parameters for those elements to immediately begin interacting brilliantly "just happened to appear" - all this without an intelligent cause required. And not after billions of years of gradual changes, but in mere moments and on a scale we can scarcely fathom. I believe ALL things have a cause, and the more complex and intricate their design, the more they require an intelligent designer and builder. So those who think what happened at the moment of the Big Bang didn't have an intelligent cause - that is faith in uncaused magic - which is the ultimate superstition!

People that have some kind of theistic belief are by FAR in the majority in this country - and yet Ed doesn't think they should have the right to weigh in politically???!!! Not to mention, he doesn't realize the ONLY reason we have a right to vote on ANYTHING is because of Democracy, which was born out of Christian beliefs. Note that all but Bernie, running on the left, at least claim to believe in God (or some god) - so what is his point about those of faith?

And Rick makes an important point - IF God exists and He has the ability to create a marvelous universe from nothing - then I think we can trust Him to have the ability to work things out for those that love Him - even if we find it mysterious as to how He operates. God doesn't have to have perfect people - or even those of faith - to accomplish what He wants and when. Ed appears to believe that God would always operate by what our best minds would consider logical. But He is God and we aren't omnipotent!

Gentlemen, I apologize for losing my temper and for my poorly chosen words, but I also ask that the rest of you spend a second reflecting on your own statements.

For example, I find the insistence that late term abortion is infanticide to be both dishonest and insulting. And being told that my priorities are screwed up because I don't think that providing an abortion to a rape victim should be a Class 1 felony? That there is deeply offensive to me. The continued claim that the "radical left" wants to murder babies is also dishonest and deeply insulting. I could provide more examples, but I think the point is clear - there are a lot of rhetorical fireballs flying around and I'm not the only one chucking them.

I have my temper back under control and I'll do my best to keep it there, or at least to refrain from hitting the post button. I ask that the rest of you do the same.

Byblos wrote: ↑Fri Mar 13, 2020 8:17 amI pride myself in using well thought-out, rational arguments based in facts.

And my counter is that your Christian worldview leads you to interpret facts and evidence in a certain way, with the end result being that when you drill down to the bedrock your views on human reproduction and abortion are religiously based.

Byblos wrote: ↑Fri Mar 13, 2020 8:17 amThis is not a case of misinformation, you're nothing but a phony 2-bit leftist hack who is deliberately spreading lies and who just exposed himself for who he truly is.

Which lies would those be? I don't believe that I've told any.

Philip wrote: ↑Fri Mar 13, 2020 8:21 amPeople that have some kind of theistic belief are by FAR in the majority in this country - and yet Ed doesn't think they should have the right to weigh in politically???!!!

Cut it out, Phil. Ed explicitly said that he supports their right to weigh in politically but sometimes wishes they wouldn't. Scroll up and you'll see it. I have no desire to disenfranchise anyone.

Philip wrote: ↑Fri Mar 13, 2020 8:21 amNot to mention, he doesn't realize the ONLY reason we have a right to vote on ANYTHING is because of Democracy, which was born out of Christian beliefs.

I'm not sure where you're getting that. Democracy was born out of pagan Greek beliefs and influenced by pagan Roman beliefs. Sure, the guys who wrote the Magna Carta were Christian, but so were the absolute monarchs they were trying to constrain. Yeah, the Founding Fathers were mostly Christians, but so were the Tories, the Red Coats, Parliament, and the King. You can't give credit to Christian reformers while overlooking the fact that their reforms were aimed at creating a more equitable Christian society by taking power from the Christian lords and the Christian Church and giving it to Christian commoners. Gotta take the good with the bad, and over the centuries Christianity was the basis for plenty of both.

edwardmurphy wrote: ↑Fri Mar 13, 2020 9:54 am

Byblos wrote: ↑Fri Mar 13, 2020 8:17 amI pride myself in using well thought-out, rational arguments based in facts.

And my counter is that your Christian worldview leads you to interpret facts and evidence in a certain way, with the end result being that when you drill down to the bedrock your views on human reproduction and abortion are religiously based.

As we all do, our worldviews tend to shape our beliefs and vice versa. What exactly is your point, other than to advance the bold-faced lie that our beliefs are SOLELY responsible for our worldview.

edwardmurphy wrote: ↑Fri Mar 13, 2020 9:54 am

Byblos wrote: ↑Fri Mar 13, 2020 8:17 amThis is not a case of misinformation, you're nothing but a phony 2-bit leftist hack who is deliberately spreading lies and who just exposed himself for who he truly is.

Which lies would those be? I don't believe that I've told any.

edwardmurphy wrote: ↑Fri Mar 13, 2020 7:14 am I sometimes wish that people who make their decisions based largely on what I regard as superstition would opt out of the political process, and on

Those lies. Whether or not you prefaced it with ' ... what I regard ...' is irrelevant. Anyone else I would have dismissed it as just ignorance but not with you, you're far too intellgient to spew such non-sense and you know it. Have you even read any, ANY of my other posts on the existence of God and countless other threads from others here arguing from REASON ALONE for the existence of God? If you can honestly tell me that you haven't then I will apologize and forgive your ignorance, as long as you do the same and admit yours. Otherwise, the charge remains.

edwardmurphy wrote: ↑Fri Mar 13, 2020 9:54 am For example, I find the insistence that late term abortion is infanticide to be both dishonest and insulting.

And very slick pivot, by the way. What happened to the 22-week cutoff? Would that have anything to do with my post on NYS RHA?