Evidence for God from Science

B. W. wrote: How about a voice from a book - would that work for you. Same principle...

Problem with the book, it was written by men who said "trust me this is the truth"! I guess I don't trust them. Also your book looks like all the other religious books to a skeptic like myself.

B.W. wrote:Why haven't you listened?

if he speaks I will hear him weather I listen or not. Thus far I haven't heard him speak.

B.W. wrote:How about the voice from the earth, sea, sun, moon, sky, the entire universe. Same principle...

Why haven't you listened?

When I listen to the earth, sea, sun, moon and sky, I don't hear what you hear.



Ken
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Kenny wrote: God never changes; right? He is the same today, as he was yesterday; right? Yesterday he had no problem making it obvious! When Jesus was baptised, he had no problem with a voice comming from the sky, with moses he parted the Red Sea, with Jesus he turned water into wine, walked on water, and raised people from the dead! With Elijah he sent a whirlwind to Earth to take him to heaven, so if he is the same today, why isn't he doing any of that stuff today?

Ken

your question is flawed. You are assuming that what God has done in the past was done with the intent to satisfy skeptics. it wasn't.
Miracles confirm the message and the messenger. God's message and final revelation was confirmed in the resurrection. And no one who was not a contemporary of Christ's penned any scripture afterwards. The canon is closed, therefore there is nothing revelatory left to reveal. so yes, God never changes. He never acts arbitrarily.

Furstentum Liechtenstein wrote:

Kenny wrote:God never changes; right? He is the same today, as he was yesterday; right? Yesterday he had no problem making it obvious! When Jesus was baptised, he had no problem with a voice comming from the sky, with moses he parted the Red Sea, with Jesus he turned water into wine, walked on water, and raised people from the dead! With Elijah he sent a whirlwind to Earth to take him to heaven, so if he is the same today, why isn't he doing any of that stuff today?

I could answer you but you wouldn't understand. Plus, I like seeing you make a fool of yourself!

FL

(LOL) Did you really think your trivial little insults would discourage me? I'm afraid you gonna have to do a little better than that my friend; I've been called worse by better people than you!

Ken

jlay wrote:

Kenny wrote: God never changes; right? He is the same today, as he was yesterday; right? Yesterday he had no problem making it obvious! When Jesus was baptised, he had no problem with a voice comming from the sky, with moses he parted the Red Sea, with Jesus he turned water into wine, walked on water, and raised people from the dead! With Elijah he sent a whirlwind to Earth to take him to heaven, so if he is the same today, why isn't he doing any of that stuff today?

Ken

your question is flawed. You are assuming that what God has done in the past was done with the intent to satisfy skeptics. it wasn't.
Miracles confirm the message and the messenger. God's message and final revelation was confirmed in the resurrection. And no one who was not a contemporary of Christ's penned any scripture afterwards. The canon is closed, therefore there is nothing revelatory left to reveal. so yes, God never changes. He never acts arbitrarily.

Thanks for the answer.

Ken

Kenny wrote:

B. W. wrote:How about a voice from a book - would that work for you. Same principle...

Problem with the book, it was written by men who said "trust me this is the truth"! I guess I don't trust them. Also your book looks like all the other religious books to a skeptic like myself.

You are a man, why then should we trust you?

Kenny wrote:

B.W. wrote:Why haven't you listened?

if he speaks I will hear him weather I listen or not. Thus far I haven't heard him speak.

God has and is but you are not listening because skeptic's cannot hear. How could they?

One other point, skeptic's like yourself cannot believe what they see either...

Kenny wrote:

B.W. wrote:How about the voice from the earth, sea, sun, moon, sky, the entire universe. Same principle...

Why haven't you listened?

When I listen to the earth, sea, sun, moon and sky, I don't hear what you hear.

Ken

When you look at the universe in the night sky, what do you see?
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BW
You are a man, why then should we trust you?

Ken
Tell you what; if there ever comes a time when you find me claiming to be speaking for God..... DON’T TRUST ME!

BW
God has and is but you are not listening because skeptic's cannot hear. How could they?

Ken
My hearing is as good as yours

BW
One other point, skeptic's like yourself cannot believe what they see either...

Ken
Now how did you make that leap?


BW
When you look at the universe in the night sky, what do you see?

Ken
Stars, and planets; the same thing you see.

Kenny wrote:My hearing is as good as yours

Kenny, I'm not sure if you're aware of this, so let me go ahead and make it as clear as possible. We're not talking about physical hearing. (Although, that is possible and has happened.) We're talking about "hearing" God's voice inside of you. I'm not one to describe this voice to you, but I just want you to be aware that it's not a physical voice.

Kenny wrote:Stars, and planets; the same thing you see.

That's not what I see. I see God's voice. The voice of God is coming from the sky: the stars, the planets, the galaxies, the nebulae, the pulsars and black holes and all of His other glorious creations! See Kenny, God is calling out to you. He's telling you who He is, what He's all about, and who He want's you to be. But you're not listening. You're asking all these questions, but you blatantly refuse the answers given to you. On what grounds? The "fact" that we have no proof? We do have proof, but the proof is a personal relationship with God Almighty. I'm trying to show you the proof, but you won't see it! Look at the proof, Kenny. Take a glimpse and you'll agree that it is, indeed, proof. Enough proof to make me say, "I don't care what kind 'proof' you have against my God. No kind of 'proof' can deny my proof!"

FlawedIntellect wrote:——————————————————————————————————————————————————————————————————————————————————————

Kenny wrote:

jlay wrote:

1over137 wrote:

Proud and arrogant people will not find God.

This is absolutely correct.
I've asked Atheist, "If there were indisputable evidence that the Bible were true, and thus Christianity were true, would you become a Christian?" They emphatically said, "NO!!"
It is impossible for the proud to come to God.

That's funny! I*ve asked Christians, "if there were indisputable evidence that the bible were false, and thus christianity were false, would you burn your bibles and become an atheist" They emphatically said "NO"!

I guess that kinda works both ways huh?


Ken

What does your comment above have to do with your question for this thread? Absolutely nothing. That post was completely pointless.

So let me see if I've got this straight; he makes a comment that has nothing to do with this thread and you have no problem with that; I reply to his comment by using his own words and logic against him and you are all up in arms? can you at least pretend to be fair and unbiased about this? or is that too much to ask.

Ken

kenny wrote this example of irony:
...can you at least pretend to be fair and unbiased about this? or is that too much to ask.

Kenny,

Your entire time here has been a perfect example of someone who is unfair and biased.

Kenny wrote:

Kenny wrote:

FlawedIntellect wrote:——————————————————————————————————————————————————————————————————————————————————————

Kenny wrote:

jlay wrote: This is absolutely correct.
I've asked Atheist, "If there were indisputable evidence that the Bible were true, and thus Christianity were true, would you become a Christian?" They emphatically said, "NO!!"
It is impossible for the proud to come to God.

That's funny! I*ve asked Christians, "if there were indisputable evidence that the bible were false, and thus christianity were false, would you burn your bibles and become an atheist" They emphatically said "NO"!

I guess that kinda works both ways huh?


Ken

What does your comment above have to do with your question for this thread? Absolutely nothing. That post was completely pointless.

So let me see if I've got this straight; he makes a comment that has nothing to do with this thread and you have no problem with that; I reply to his comment by using his own words and logic against him and you are all up in arms? can you at least pretend to be fair and unbiased about this? or is that too much to ask.

Ken

Wrong. Jlay's response was completely relevant to the original post. It backed up his point that most people /simply wouldn't care/, even if they heard the voice of God physically.

Your attempt at "using his logic against him" is more of an effort to derail your own thread and not even listen to what people are saying.
You asked the question of what people would do if God on high were to reveal himself to everyone in an irrefutable way. You didn't like the answer you got. So then you turn around to mock peoples' responses. Conveniently enough, the proof is right in the quotes above.

Kenny wrote:

B. W. wrote:You are a man, why then should we trust you?

Tell you what; if there ever comes a time when you find me claiming to be speaking for God..... DON’T TRUST ME!

You speak from man and you stated nothing can be trusted written by man, therefore, why should we trust you are correct now about what you are writing about God then?

Kenny wrote:

B. W. wrote:God has and is but you are not listening because skeptic's cannot hear. How could they?

My hearing is as good as yours

How do you know? If I hear from God and you say I can't, then your hearing is not as good as mine now is it?

Kenny wrote:

B. W. wrote:One other point, skeptic's like yourself cannot believe what they see either...

Now how did you make that leap?

Answered as a true skeptic...

Kenny wrote:

B. W. wrote:When you look at the universe in the night sky, what do you see?

Stars, and planets; the same thing you see.

Where did these stars, planets, etc, you empirically see get where they are?
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BW
You speak from man and you stated nothing can be trusted written by man, therefore, why should we trust you are correct now about what you are writing about God then?

Ken
I didn’t say nothing can be trusted, just not this. As far as trusting what I believe about God, I am not asking you to believe me, I am just explaining why I believe the way I do

BW
How do you know? If I hear from God and you say I can't, then your hearing is not as good as mine now is it?

Ken
When I say “hear” I mean audible sounds. I suspect you mean something different; am I correct?

BW
Answered as a true skeptic...

Ken
Well maybe I am not a “true” skeptic; (what-ever that is) but just a skeptic because unless looking at an optical illusion, I believe what I see.

BW
Where did these stars, planets, etc, you empirically see get where they are

Ken
I don’t pretend to know all the right answers, but I can sometimes recognize a wrong answer.

Ken

acid1103 wrote:

Kenny wrote:My hearing is as good as yours

Kenny, I'm not sure if you're aware of this, so let me go ahead and make it as clear as possible. We're not talking about physical hearing. (Although, that is possible and has happened.) We're talking about "hearing" God's voice inside of you. I'm not one to describe this voice to you, but I just want you to be aware that it's not a physical voice.

Thank-you. Audible voices are the only voices I am capable of hearing.

acid1103 wrote:That's not what I see. I see God's voice. The voice of God is coming from the sky: the stars, the planets, the galaxies, the nebulae, the pulsars and black holes and all of His other glorious creations! See Kenny, God is calling out to you. He's telling you who He is, what He's all about, and who He want's you to be. But you're not listening. You're asking all these questions, but you blatantly refuse the answers given to you.

If God is going to speak to me, he would have to speak to me in a language I can understand, otherwise everything he says will be dismissed due to the fact that I do not speak his language.

Kenny wrote: Thank-you. Audible voices are the only voices I am capable of hearing.

I can hear my internal voice in my head when I read stuff or think inside my head and that's not audible.

Danieltwotwenty wrote:

Kenny wrote: Thank-you. Audible voices are the only voices I am capable of hearing.

I can hear my internal voice in my head when I read stuff or think inside my head and that's not audible.

My internal voice only consists of thoughts. I am unable to hear thoughts; not even my own. However if God wanted to communicate to me via thoughts I would get the message; but that has never happened

Ken