Evidence for God from Science

Nobody's faith here is on the line due to your worldview. You're the only one here with hostile remarks, and it gets worse because now you expose more lies.

You commit the tu quoque fallacy multiple times. My philosophy and foundation allow me to build my conclusions. Yours cannot because knowledge and subsequent propositions cannot be known and therefore there is no value there. Its practically atheist with a slight modification. Love is arbitrary as objectively "good" or as a "virtue". There is simply no way you know a single thing about love. If the Tao cannot be known, then you cannot know love. End of story. If it cannot be known, then you simply need to literally shutup. But here you are, still talking about what you think you know. You are man in ignorance, not in enlightenment. Thats the philosophical implications, sir. Don't like it? Abandon it.

Its interesting that you think suffering is the problem. In our view, Jesus' suffering is the solution. Emotional appeals do not invalidate the truth of the ressurection of Christ. All are condemned. All are judged based on their response to the gospel and general revelation. Jesus is THE way, THE truth, THE light, and no one gets to the father except thru the passion of Jesus Christ on the cross. It is by God's grace, and not by works alone.

There is no contradiction. I am not smarter then God. I maintain a philosophical position of analytic philosophy that God can be understood and that he is personal another distinctive entity because all scientific and logical proof shows that in the Kalam cosmological argument. I have never postulated anything as ridiculous that I will make it to heaven by condemning you. I have never claimed that I am the judge, jury, and executioner. Where did I say that, sir?

You on the other hand say that YOU are GOD and that other people are or can be God, too. If that's who you think God is, then yes, I probably am smarter then most of these self professed Gods out there.

I never said 2+2 is God. You're again, mistaken. That illustration is for fact-value distinctions and exclusive truth as a logical and consistent conclusion. Propositions, truth, and knowledge exist and can be known. There are criteria for those proofs.

You need to define truth and knowledge before you attempt to use them in a sentence, friend.

What is truth?
What is knowledge? What is the criteria for knowledge?
What relationship do they have with each other?

Stick to the facts, and lose the rhetoric. Again, never did I say that winning an argument gets me to heaven. If that was true, then the Shinto Buddhist couple, the Mormon, and 6 unitarian universalists I have converted to Christianity will pointlessly testify for me and perhaps I can go rob a bank now or something hoping I was right? I don't hold that view, sir. That's absurd. Again, my entrance into heaven depends on what I do with the foundation that is Jesus Christ because he is the ONLY way I can response to God.

Don't worry about embarrassing me. You don't. Find something else to worry about like avoiding the naturalist fallacy, ad hominem attacks, and the tu quoque fallacy. Especially tu quoque. You come to your own conclusions, sir. You come to your own conclusions via your philosophy, not mine. Got it?

Btw, your response to BW and jlay is ridiculous. Try listening to them instead of making ridiculous claims with baseless proof.

buddhawarrior wrote: ARgh, must I sink to such lows as to explain to you your own idiocy?

Buddhawarrior, Not BUDDHIST Warrior. Silly boy.

Buddha is just a label for someone who is enlightened.

Buddhist is someone who follows a set of practices to attain enlightenment.

I do not follow a set of practices, but seek only enlightenment thru whatever means. The success of the end goal is all that matters. The labels others put on me, or I put on myself does not matter, and mean nothing.

Jesus was not Christian. and Gautama was not a Buddhist.

If you only want to be a follower, that is your choice. But I've set my aim a bit higher. I'm willing to destroy my own ego like a warrior slays his enemies to attain the only thing worth living for. Call it whatever you want, Christ Consciousness, Buddha nature, Ultimate Yoga, Union with the Divine, Enlightenment, Awakening, the name does not matter, only the perpetual experience of it matters.

If you must call me names just to boost your own sense of self worth, that's too bad. It is your eternal salvation at stake, not mine. But please see how you sound, like a frightened little baby. You are so afraid of losing your religion that you are wiling to throw out the baby with the bath water. Don't you see, in this argument, no one wins unless we all win. It does not matter who is right, it matters that you see the truth. That you have been scared, you have been afraid, and you are willing to crucify the first real voice you've heard just to protect your ego.

I make the same offer to you as I do to anyone on this site. You can send me a private message if you wish to continue this conversation. But within the scope of this site, you are not allowed to change your mind.

I'm sorry if your passive aggressive slander had prompted me to take the gloves off. But I hope you see my point. but of course, I already know you won't. Your fear and anger is too great. It swallows you up and disallows you to see the truth when it's staring at you in the face. You wish only to destroy it, so you can go back to your sinful ways. But that won't help you. Not if you are truly seeking salvation. Go ahead, keep looking for contradictions, you will find many. You will win many arguments, and you will have your friend Domo to pat your on the back. But guess what, you've missed the point. the Two of you are shaking hands in hell. Congratulations.

Thank you for finally stating what you believe in: enlightenment.

How do you define that term?

What does it mean?

You stated:

buddhawarrior wrote:I do not follow a set of practices, but seek only enlightenment thru whatever means. The success of the end goal is all that matters. The labels others put on me, or I put on myself does not matter, and mean nothing.

How can you not follow any set of practices when not following is in itself a set practices? You claim that the end Goal is to be achieved by whatever means and then refuse whatever means the God of the Universe chooses to save you is very limited and narrow minded.

How many Zen Slaps must I give your neophyte mind?

Jesus is God manifest in Human flesh and not a Buddha. He still works miracles and the most common is a changed life of those that trust in him. They no longer have to seek after themselves and the gods they make to grant them a cheap mental thrill. For those of who know him, know who he is, we know what he has done, and what he desires to do for you. It is you that seeks after the knowledge of nothingness.

Buddhism – seeking of enlightenment wisdom is a perversion of King Solomon’s wisdom and proverbs. The enlighten path you speak of came 400 years after Solomon. You claim to have been a Christian but you never were as you seek other paths that puff the mind to reject Godhead that the bible reveals. God to you is only yourself – so you practice that set of principles that justify your mode of thinking.

For those of us who know Jesus, personally, know our security is fixed and eternal. We place our trust in what he said and the testimony from the bible. As one old hymn says – He walks, with us and talks with us through life’s ways. We who know Him have been sealed by the Holy Spirit of promise. You have not. It is you who gets angry and condescending – not me. You get angry because you harbor hate and bitterness towards God – the great Creator of the universe. That is what is keeping you from finding truth and separates you from the Godhead. Stopping running from the only One that can save your life! Stop mocking him and following after strange gods you create.

Jesus died for our sins. What does that mean to you? Have any idea?

You claim to seek after enlightenment but reject the Holy Spirit calling out to you to return and be reconciled to the Godhead. Enlightenment you state is what you are after, well how can you really be when are you have NO idea about what is meant by Christ dying for our sins? You do not seek after that truth – do you?

Its’ not too late, Christ is reaching for you –wanting to prove himself to you. Stop slapping his outstretched hand away from you. Turn away from what you are doing, seeking people to worship you as god. You are not nor ever will you be.

That is why you are on this forum – seeking people to worship you as god.

Stop denying the one true way in exchange for another that leads to the nirvana of nowhere of nothingness. That is only suicidal thinking justified - desiring to drag as many others down with them.

We are trying to save your life and are concerned for your very soul but you are not about ours - only desire us to bow and worship a hurt human being with a chip on thier shoulder and an axe to grind. Why do you hate God that the bible speaks of - why not talk about something of real value for a change and test your seeking...
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Sorry Jlay, I've run out of patience today, and might just give it to you straight.

I tell my 2 year old daughter certain things because it's easy for her to understand. You obviously are on the same level as my two year old. Yes, for you, my child, you must eliminate desire to eliminate suffering.

However, if you were older and wiser, and have tried to practice the elimination of desire, and have failed at it, I would tell you something else.

Now you have failed at attempting to eliminate your desire, you are ready for step two. ELIMINATE YOUR DESIRE FOR ELIMINATING DESIRE.

I don't think I should tell you more, because you are obviously a noob. so try that exercise and if you have more questions, i would be happy to do my best in answering.
buddhawarriorFamiliar Member Posts: 33Joined: Fri Jan 27, 2012 4:32 pm

Let's see you accuse me of being childish while resorting to name calling? And who is being childish?

buddhawarrior wrote:

jlay wrote:

Jlay, buddhism does NOT seek to eliminate desire.

?? It states that the source of suffering is desire, and to eliminate suffering desire must be eliminated. Does it not say this?

Also, you say logic will not lead to enlightenment. First, define enlightenment.
2nd, I would be curiuos why all the Buddhist sources attempt to employ logic to defend their beliefs.

Sorry Jlay, I've run out of patience today, and might just give it to you straight.

I tell my 2 year old daughter certain things because it's easy for her to understand. You obviously are on the same level as my two year old. Yes, for you, my child, you must eliminate desire to eliminate suffering.

However, if you were older and wiser, and have tried to practice the elimination of desire, and have failed at it, I would tell you something else.

Now you have failed at attempting to eliminate your desire, you are ready for step two. ELIMINATE YOUR DESIRE FOR ELIMINATING DESIRE.

I don't think I should tell you more, because you are obviously a noob. so try that exercise and if you have more questions, i would be happy to do my best in answering.

Buddhawarrior, knock off the insults or you will be banned. Review the discussion guidelines again. This is your final warning.

Anyone is welcome to take part here, but the discussion should be about the topic, not these kind of insults.

B. W. wrote: How many Zen Slaps must I give your neophyte mind?

This made me spit my tea. Now my pants are wet.
Thank you.

I like what a lot of you are saying, I don't believe in an outdated book, I believe in god and in caring for each-other, and I wrote my objections about the bible on this site and all anyone did was make fun of me for my username and call my question "bunk". Or, write down a bunch of new verses that did not get to my point. They totally disregarded the words where I said I believe in compassion and love, and so forth. It was very annoying.

I'm sorry if you think that we are trying to put you down... I promise we don't mean to! We are just stating our beliefs as you state yours. Just so happens that this site is hosted by those of our beliefs...

Man I read the first page and thought our friend buddhawarrior was looking like a level-headed, calm fellow; then I skipped to the last page and I see the proverbial has hit the fan

We've all heard these arguments before; but in the end you cannot deny or twist the meaning of John 14:6.

Jesus said to him, “I am the way, and the truth, and the life; no one comes to the Father but through Me".

It was through the blood of Jesus, his sacrifice, on the cross that our sins are forgiven.

buddhawarrior, this is the core belief of Christianity.
No one is saying that you can't believe what you want to believe; but attempting to alter what has been at the heart of Christianity for over 2 000 years seems a tad much.

Jesus was clear in what he said. One either accepts it or you don't. It's why there are cults and off-shoots of Christianity.