Evidence for God from Science

Oldman,
Your Spiritual Embryo belief presents a false Christ.

As believers, we are told to preach the Gospel of Jesus Christ. Not some New Age, Taoist, Gnostic, spiritual embryo false christ.

Oldman,

If you want to believe in a false christ, you are free to do so. But you are not free to continually preach your false christ here.

oldman wrote:

B.W. wrote:First off, the bible clearly teaches that it is Jesus who was faithful unto death

Yes, it is Jesus who was faithful unto death, the Spirit that ruled in Him is the reason why He was faithful unto death, and it is precisely this same Spirit that must rule in us if we are going to be trusted to live and serve God and creation forever. Only when this Spirit lives and rules in us will our old corrupt spirit of lies and delusion be put to death.

Actually look at you grammar you used in your sentence construct and I quote you: Only the pure and faithful Spirit that has proved faithful to love us unto death will have no reason to deceive and “offend” any of us, such is the Spirit that is revealed by the Lord Jesus and by His true followers...

You specifically stated that the spirit loved unto death - not Jesus. It is written:

Acts 2:23 Him, being delivered by the determined purpose and foreknowledge of God, you have taken by lawless hands, have crucified, and put to death;

Rom 5:10 For if when we were enemies we were reconciled to God through the death of His Son, much more, having been reconciled, we shall be saved by His life.

Php 2:8 And being found in appearance as a man, He humbled Himself and became obedient to the point of death, even the death of the cross.

Rev 1:18 I am He who lives, and was dead, and behold, I am alive forevermore. Amen. And I have the keys of Hades and of Death.

You are reading into the scripture and stating that the spirit died along with Jesus - this is not so. The bible does not teach your doctrine.

oldman wrote:Let me repeat what I said earlier but make myself more clear.

Only the pure and faithful Spirit that is faithful to love us unto death (that was revealed in the Lord Jesus when He ministered and died on earth) will have no reason to deceive and offend (by“offend” I mean offend so that we be harmed and offended eternally) any of us, such is the Spirit that is revealed by His true followers.

You should have used a better way to convey than write a sentence the way you did but again, you are stating the spirit died as well with Jesus, which the bible does not teach. Next, nowhere did you define clearly what you meant by offend until now. This unclarity displays how little truth your spirit of truth has...

How do I know the Lord and the Holy Spirit? easy, he does not violate the bible one iota as the one in you does...

oldman wrote:

B.W. wrote:Why, to reveal truth in order to reveal the true state of a person's heart either sealing it for eternal punishment or coming to ones senses for His salvafic work. Again, your statements goes contrary to the principles found in the bible on the subject of truth and how God hardens the heart by sending strong delusions...

This Jesus could not have lied because in His Spirit revealed throughout His life and death on earth and through the lives and deaths of many of His true followers throughout history, there can be seen no reason to lie.

No where does it say God lies by sending a strong delusion. It is the manner in which it is done as the delusion sent reveals the truth concerning what a person desires more than than God. So in truth, God sends a delusion, that reveals the truth about the human heart within a person, which exposes why they are condemned. There is no injustice in this based in this due to God's foreknowledge of the final effect that his word will have before anyone was ever born. So, the issue - is about sending a strong delusion sent in truth exposing the real person - not about lying.

Again, you attempt to twist words which exposes what about yourself?

oldman wrote:

B.W. wrote:Next, we already discussed earlier that Jesus Christ is not a created being who came into being due to being a mere a thought in the eternal mind of God. That idea you have is decidedly Gnostic and presents another Jesus, not the true Jesus, but another jesus. Wake up oldman...

I have woken up to the true Jesus, the Son of God, the Son of reason.

“In the beginning was the Word” (In the beginning the eternal Son existed only in the eternal thoughts of the Father as a spiritual embryo.) “and the Word was with God, and the Word was God” (This Word, this embryo became a facsimile of the Father, not a creation as such but another part of the Father. This 2nd mind became another person like the Father, the Father's Son before creation began.) “He was with God in the beginning. All things were made through Him,” (through the Father and the Son's pure and perfect love for each other they began creating everything whilst giving that love to all who they created.) “without him nothing was made that has been made.” John 1:1-3.

As the eternal Son existed and grew within the eternal Father before creation began, so the eternal Spirit of truth existed and grew with the Son in the eternal Father also.

To deny the Son came from His Father by the will of His Father in eternity before creation began, as false teachers often do, is to deny the true meaning of the words “Father” and “Son” that were used by God to describe the 1st and 2nd person in the Godhead.

By denying the Son came from His Father before creation began, false teachers seek to lead others to deny the bond of perfect love that only a perfect Father and Son can give to each other.

False teachers seek to lead men to ignore and reject the unique Father and Son relationship that gave us the Spirit of truth.

The 1st and 2nd person of the Godhead were not revealed to us as “Father” and “Son” for nothing, as many false teachers would have us believe.

Here I rest my case as proof that you teach another gospel and a created jesus. Thank you for clarifying this. Again your belief is error. The truth as the bible states is that the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit always existed co-eternally - co-equally with each other, and that none came into existence due to being in the thought of some sort of divine mind as you so clearly stated.

The bible does not teach this. Jesus said of himself in Rev 1:8,17,18 as always existing...

Next, if what you cite is actually true, this poses a logical contradiction concerning what YHWH said concerning himself:

Isa 41:4 "Who has performed and accomplished it, Calling forth the generations from the beginning? 'I, the LORD, am the first, and with the last. I am He.'"

Isa 44:6 "Thus says the LORD, the King of Israel and his Redeemer, the LORD of hosts: 'I am the first and I am the last, And there is no God besides Me.

Isa 43:10 "You are My witnesses," declares the LORD, "And My servant whom I have chosen, So that you may know and believe Me And understand that I am He. Before Me there was no God formed, And there will be none after Me. NKJV

For your doctrine to be true, then God formed another God within his own mind and thus violated the above verses cited about what God says about himself...as well as the verse cited from the NKJV below...

Isa 42:8 "I am the LORD, that is My name; I will not give My glory to another, Nor My praise to graven images.

Isa 48:11 "For My own sake, for My own sake, I will act; For how can My name be profaned? And My glory I will not give to another.

Your doctrine is great error and Philippians 2:5,6,7,8,9,10 brings this out as well as identifies who was speaking in Isa 45:21-25: "Declare and set forth your case; Indeed, let them consult together. Who has announced this from of old? Who has long since declared it? Is it not I, the LORD? And there is no other God besides Me, A righteous God and a Savior; There is none except Me. 22 "Turn to Me and be saved, all the ends of the earth; For I am God, and there is no other. 23 "I have sworn by Myself, The word has gone forth from My mouth in righteousness And will not turn back, That to Me every knee will bow, every tongue will swear allegiance. 24 "They will say of Me, 'Only in the LORD are righteousness and strength.' Men will come to Him, And all who were angry at Him will be put to shame. 25 "In the LORD all the offspring of Israel Will be justified and will glory." NASB

Well that should be enough for the readers to see clearly that you do indeed preach another jesus and a false gospel....
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In my previous post I asked you the question, Can you explain why you believe the one you call “the Holy Spirit” is telling you the truth?

The nearest answer I got was:

B. W. wrote: How do I know the Lord and the Holy Spirit? easy, he does not violate the bible one iota as the one in you does...

I am sorry but that is not really a satisfactory answer. Let me rephrase the question, Can you explain why you believe the one you call “the Holy Spirit” living in you, is indeed telling you the truth and guiding you to interpret God's written word correctly?

In other words, why do you believe the one you call “the Spirit of truth” is not in fact deceiving you when you study the Bible?



Can you also explain please why you believe. "every sin and blasphemy will be forgiven men, but the blasphemy against the Spirit will not be forgiven. Anyone who speaks a word against the Son of Man will be forgiven, but anyone who speaks against the Holy Spirit will not be forgiven, either in this age or in the age to come". Matthew 12:31-32?

Why do you believe the man who dares to show contempt for this Spirit is without hope and is condemned forever?

oldman wrote:In my previous post I asked you the question, Can you explain why you believe the one you call “the Holy Spirit” is telling you the truth?

The nearest answer I got was:

B. W. wrote: How do I know the Lord and the Holy Spirit? easy, he does not violate the bible one iota as the one in you does...

I am sorry but that is not really a satisfactory answer. Let me rephrase the question, Can you explain why you believe the one you call “the Holy Spirit” living in you, is indeed telling you the truth and guiding you to interpret God's written word correctly?

In other words, why do you believe the one you call “the Spirit of truth” is not in fact deceiving you when you study the Bible?

Can you also explain please why you believe. "every sin and blasphemy will be forgiven men, but the blasphemy against the Spirit will not be forgiven. Anyone who speaks a word against the Son of Man will be forgiven, but anyone who speaks against the Holy Spirit will not be forgiven, either in this age or in the age to come". Matthew 12:31-32?

Why do you believe the man who dares to show contempt for this Spirit is without hope and is condemned forever?

Here is why and how I know for sure...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h2X5uAB692A

I met him in a personal way - how about you?

Next, everything I learned is backed up in the bible - it is true as it is written in 2 Timothy 2:13, 14, "If we are faithless, He remains faithful; He cannot deny Himself... "

The Lord cannot deny himself in any shape or form. The jesus you present denies this truth. What I am hearing you say is that your embryo jesus and gnostic spirit of truth is greater than what the bible reveals about God. That is not so...oldman as it is written in Numbers 23:19; Titus 1:2; Heb 6:18, Isa 46:10; Isa 55:11; Eph 1:9-11

God will not violate his own words recorded within the bible. I met the Lord personally, and you came to the Lord by eating cannabis, a hallucinogenic, by which you concoct an anti biblical concept of an embryonic jesus inhabited by some sort of gnostic anointing, sorry old man. You do not know the real Jesus Christ, nor his power that will set you free from whatever holds you captive. You do not have the truth.

The Lord Yehovah (YHWH) Almighty always verifies himself within in bible. I learned that from my encounter and with His Book I remain true in order to help others find the living Lord of Glory so they can be as it is written in Isaiah 61:1-4 NLT, quoted below:

"The Spirit of the Sovereign Lord is upon me, for the Lord has anointed me to bring good news to the poor. He has sent me to comfort the brokenhearted and to proclaim that captives will be released and prisoners will be freed,

2 He has sent me to tell those who mourn that the time of the Lord’s favor has come,and with it, the day of God’s anger against their enemies.

3 To all who mourn in Israel,he will give a crown of beauty for ashes,a joyous blessing instead of mourning,festive praise instead of despair. In their righteousness, they will be like great oaks that the Lord has planted for his own glory.

4 They will rebuild the ancient ruins, repairing cities destroyed long ago.They will revive them, though they have been deserted for many generations."

Do you want to meet the Lord of Glory or remain outside the camp? That choice is yours...
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B. W. wrote:

oldman wrote:In my previous post I asked you the question, Can you explain why you believe the one you call “the Holy Spirit” is telling you the truth?

The nearest answer I got was:

B. W. wrote: How do I know the Lord and the Holy Spirit? easy, he does not violate the bible one iota as the one in you does...

I am sorry but that is not really a satisfactory answer. Let me rephrase the question, Can you explain why you believe the one you call “the Holy Spirit” living in you, is indeed telling you the truth and guiding you to interpret God's written word correctly?

In other words, why do you believe the one you call “the Spirit of truth” is not in fact deceiving you when you study the Bible?

Can you also explain please why you believe. "every sin and blasphemy will be forgiven men, but the blasphemy against the Spirit will not be forgiven. Anyone who speaks a word against the Son of Man will be forgiven, but anyone who speaks against the Holy Spirit will not be forgiven, either in this age or in the age to come". Matthew 12:31-32

Why do you believe the man who dares to show contempt for this Spirit is without hope and is condemned forever?

Here is why and how I know for sure...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h2X5uAB692A

I met him in a personal way - how about you?

I became convinced of the reality of God as I came to the end of reading the Gospel of Matthew. Whilst reading Matthew I came across some verses that made little sense to me, particularly the last verse which made no sense at all. My Gideon's New Testament, given to me when I left school was an old KJV, and not being very intelligent and not having a good understanding of English grammar, I was unable to understand the message being told. For this reason I felt a need for a Bible in modern English. After I was made aware of the reality of God, the time came a few weeks later when I finally bought my “New English Bible”. There was no alcohol in my body and it was around 3 weeks since I last used any cannabis. After acquiring my new Bible I got back to my car, and then started to flick through the Old Testament, after a few minutes I came to the beginning of the New Testament and I then remembered the main reason why I needed a New Testament in modern English. I didn't know the chapter or verse numbers I was looking for, I only remembered them being somewhere around the middle part of Matthew. I opened up the Gospel of Matthew and started reading from the first paragraph I came to when I realised I was reading the verses I was looking for. The words that I read were,

At that time Jesus spoke these words: 'I thank thee, Father, Lord of heaven and earth, for hiding these things from the learned and wise, and revealing them to the simple. Yes, Father, such was thy choice. Everything is entrusted to me by my Father; and no one knows the Son but the Father, and no one knows the Father but the Son and those to whom the Son may choose to reveal him.

This is a small part of my testimony and I will explain more if you are willing to help me by clearly answering my questions.

It is written, "And so I tell you, every kind of sin and slander can be forgiven, but blasphemy against the Spirit will not be forgiven. Anyone who speaks a word against the Son of Man will be forgiven, but anyone who speaks against the Holy Spirit will not be forgiven, either in this age or in the age to come.” Matthew 12:31-32

Why then do you believe anyone who slanders and shows contempt for this Spirit is forever without hope and can never be forgiven?

Can you explain now what you believe is the essence and character of the one you call “the Spirit of truth”?

Oldman,

The Spirit of Truth the bible speaks of is the living person, the third person of God's one divine essence, the Holy Spirit.

The Holy Spirit was never a thought in embryo in the Father's mind, nor was the second living person of God's one divine essence, known as Jesus Christ. Jesus Christ was never a thought in embryo in the Father's mind either. What you teach proves the importance of grasping the basic tenants of the Christian Orthodox doctrine of the divine Trinity because it will keep a person away from error and seducers.

What you described happened to you, identifies a seducing spirit which tricked you by its use of bible verses to flatter your ego which was wounded, betrayed, and abused long ago. This secret knowledge that it promised inflates the brain like a balloon. Makes you feel important, like you are somebody since the same spirit robbed you sometime during your life of the nurture and attention that would ensure that you really belonged. Cannabis provides a heady soothe to escape into your mind so you will not face the wounds of the past. Were you abused or neglected in some fashion - God only knows.

Notice that there are no threats coming from from myself to you. It is you who applies threat of loss of salvation towards anyone who will not agree with you. This indicates that the spirit you testify is not the Holy Spirit at all. Therefore, let me remind you that it is the goodness of God that leads a person to repentance. The true living Holy Spirit person offers a choice and that choice is yours to make alone so (we) ask you, would you like to be free and meet the real Jesus Christ who came in the flesh and destroys (unties) all the works of the devil or remain as you are?

I hate boasting but sometimes it needs to be done, you are writing to one whom Jesus Christ raised form psychical death by his grace alone for whatever His purposes were which are for His alone, not mine. From this, I can assure you that you are listening to a seducing spirit masquerading as an angel of light - truth - demanding full and complete obeisances from you. There is no grace in what it has shared to do, as well as no true God's Agape either offered - just a ooee gooey surgery high calorie variety. You have a deep seated wound it feeds off of. Yes, you can deny this all you like but what you have written up to this point on this thread betrays that much of what you share is from a bad devious spirit and not of the true living Jehovah God at all because it shares another jesus the bible does not speak of at all and it also promotes a behavior that opens one up to all sorts of new age garbage too. The Lord brought you here to be confronted with the need to meet the real Jesus, have your brokenness healed, and set free. He offers that choice to you to make or not to make - that is all...

Have a good day...


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Why do you believe anyone who blasphemes against the Holy Spirit will be condemned forever?

oldman wrote:Why do you believe anyone who blasphemes against the Holy Spirit will be condemned forever?

Matthew 12:31, 32, "Therefore I say to you, any sin and blasphemy shall be forgiven people, but blasphemy against the Spirit shall not be forgiven. 32 Whoever speaks a word against the Son of Man, it shall be forgiven him; but whoever speaks against the Holy Spirit, it shall not be forgiven him, either in this age or in the age to come." NASB95

How come Oldman you do not identify who the spirit of truth you speak of but instead choose to play games of insinuation?

Therefore, we are asking here on this forum that you explain who the spirit of truth you write of just as you did so regarding the jesus you identified as an embryo of thought within the Father's mind...

If you refuse to answer, then this thread will be locked as this is a discussion forum, and not a place to spread a false gospel.
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B. W. wrote:

oldman wrote:Why do you believe anyone who blasphemes against the Holy Spirit will be condemned forever?

How come Oldman you do not identify who the spirit of truth you speak of but instead choose to play games of insinuation?

Therefore, we are asking here on this forum that you explain who the spirit of truth you write of

I can only tell you what I know is the essence and character of the Spirit of truth, for this is all I know of Him.

Only the pure and faithful Spirit that is faithful to love us unto death revealed by the Lord Jesus when He ministered and died on earth, will have no reason to deceive and offend any of us, (by“offend” I mean offend so that we be harmed and offended eternally) such is the Spirit that is revealed by His true followers. This Jesus could not have lied because in His Spirit there can be seen no reason to lie. Recorded history tells us the faithful followers who witnessed the ministry and finished work of Jesus were in the end prepared to be persecuted to death, even tortured to death rather than live a lie and deny who they believed in or what they had witnessed: His commandments and doctrine, the love and wisdom, the miracles, the promises, the crucifixion and the resurrected Jesus Christ. Despite all the efforts of hypocrites, malicious liars and antichrists, this Spirit lives on in all His true followers still.

Whoever blasphemes against this Spirit will never be saved for there is nothing left to save them.

From the Father and the Son comes their perfect and eternal love for each other. Their love is their endless joy in their pure and perfect caring, sharing and giving to each other all that they are and all that they care to create. The Son came from the Father in eternity before creation began and He naturally looks up to His Father, but without the Father's only eternal child there would be no possibility for an eternal God known as "love", "God is love", as Scripture clearly proclaims, and this love cannot exist with one person alone. This love, this God called love, needs at least two free thinking reasoning minds, and through the eternal Son the Father became the eternal giver of joy in perfect caring and sharing, and through the eternal Father His Son became the eternal receiver and giver of this same Spirit. Without the eternal Son there would be no such Spirit of pure and perfect eternal love; and it is this eternal Spirit that comes through the Father and the Son, and with the Father and the Son, all creation is governed. This Spirit naturally embraces all knowledge and wisdom and would mean nothing without being the heart or the innermost ruling character of a person.

The Father's Spirit is being given now to each of His chosen and gives new life by transforming our corrupt and deceitful spirits of pride and death back into one of humility and holiness, just as Adam and Eve were before the Spirit of truth in them was confounded and corrupted into something evil by their desire to know evil. The Father's Spirit will live in all His chosen ones and ultimately make their unique personalities perfect in knowledge, wisdom and love forever.

The finished work of Jesus Christ reveals in full His Spirit faithful to love unto death. This Spirit is the heart of God's personality. This Spirit is what governs His reasoning. Only the Spirit that has proved faithful to love us unto death can be trusted not to deceive and "offend" anyone. Only when we are governed by this Spirit shall we be trusted to serve God and creation forever.

By reason, this Spirit is the only proven conveyor of truth, simply because there is no reasonable alternative in which we all can trust.

Whoever has contempt for this Spirit will never be saved for there is nothing left to save them.

B. W. wrote:just as you did so regarding the jesus you identified as an embryo of thought within the Father's mind...

If you refuse to answer, then this thread will be locked as this is a discussion forum, and not a place to spread a false gospel.

As you can see, I have answered. I am now seeking information from you so that I can find out more about you and the one you worship, then informed decisions can be made by myself and by others.

Always be prepared to give an answer to everyone who asks you to give the reason for the hope that you have. But do this with gentleness and respect. 1 Peter 3:15

God explains in Matthew 12:32 that every kind of sin and slander can be forgiven, apart from blasphemy against the Spirit.
Since you appear confident and sure that you know the God of truth then tell us please, what is so special about the Spirit of truth that makes blasphemy against Him an unforgivable sin?

You may have been raised from physical death by Jesus Christ B.W. but have you been raised from spiritual death? If so then explain the essence and character of the Spirit of truth you claim to know and worship. Explain why you believe that everyone who shows contempt for this Spirit is without hope and will be condemned forever.

From Hebrews 6:4-6
4 For in the case of those who have once been enlightened and have tasted of the heavenly gift and have been made partakers of the Holy Spirit, 5 and have tasted the good word of God and the powers of the age to come, 6 and then have fallen away, it is impossible to renew them again to repentance, since they again crucify to themselves the Son of God and put Him to open shame.

(Sorry for my intervention.)

Oldman,

These are your exact words regarding how you explained your view of who jesus is as: "In the beginning the eternal Son existed only in the eternal thoughts of the Father as a spiritual embryo."

It took quite a while to dig that out of you. Your last response does not clarify at all what you mean by the spirit of truth.

The created jesus you defined as, "In the beginning the eternal Son existed only in the eternal thoughts of the Father as a spiritual embryo," is not the Jesus mentioned in the bible; therefore, the alleged spirit of truth you claim cannot be either. Your theology is confused and does not line up with what is recorded in the bible how God speaks concerning himself as well as reveals about himself too.

Acts 1:4,5,6,7,8 demonstrates your error regarding the spirit of the father as does John 14:26 and John 15:26

Here is a rendering from the Pulpit Commentary on who the Holy Spirit is...

Pulpit Commentary
John 15:26, John 15:27

A new source of consolation now appears. Already twice over he has spoken of the Paraclete (John 14:16 and John 1:26),

(1) as being sent by the Father in answer to his prayer, to be the compensation to his disciples for his personal departure, and also

(2) as the Instructor and Leader into all truth. Once more he promises great things and mighty aid in their conflict with the world’s hate by the mission of the Comforter. This great mission is said to be his own. Whensoever the Paraolete of whom I have spoken shall have come, whom I will send to you from (the side of, παρὰ) the Father, the Spirit of the truth, which proceedeth from (παρὰ) the Father, he (ἐκεῖνος) shall bear witness concerning me, and you also bear witness because ye are with me from the beginning of the Messianic work (ἀπ ἀρχῆς, not ἐν ἀρχῆ). This is the great text on which the Western Church and the Greeks have alike relied for their doctrine concerning the "procession of the Spirit," the timeless, pre-mundane relations among the Personalities of the Godhead.

The expression ἐκπορεύεται only occurs in this place, and from it ἐκπορεύσις became the ecclesiastical term for the relation which the Holy Spirit sustains to the Father, just as γεννήσις was the especial term to denote the peculiarity of the Son, and just as ἀγεννήσια, the condition of unbegottenness and paternity was that used to denote the Father’s own hypostatic distinction.

The Holy Spirit is ever proceeding, issuing forth from, sent by the Father on his work of Divine self-manifestation and Divine activity in the universe. Of this there can be no question, and the Nicene symbol originally expressed it without amplification....

And from Robertson Word Pictures writes...

Robertson Word Pictures
John 15:26

When the Comforter is come (hotan elthēi ho paraklētos). Indefinite temporal clause with hotan and the second aorist active subjunctive of erchomai, “whenever the Comforter comes.”
Whom I will send unto you from the Father (hon egō pempsō humin para tou patros). As in John 16:7, but in John 14:16, John 14:26 the Father sends at the request of or in the name of Jesus. Cf. Luke 24:49; Acts 2:33. This is the Procession of the Holy Spirit from the Father and from the Son.

Which (ho). Grammatical neuter to agree with pneuma, and should be rendered “who” like ho in John 14:26.

Proceedeth from the Father (para tou patros ekporeuetai). “From beside the Father” as in the preceding clause.

He (ekeinos). Emphatic masculine pronoun, not neuter (ekeino) though following ho.

Shall bear witness of me (marturēsei peri emou). Future active of martureō. This is the mission of the Paraclete (John16:14) as it should be ours.

From these quotes which help clarify the Greek text, one can see that the Holy Spirit and Son share the same essence of the Godhead, yet, the Holy Spirit is sent from the side of the Father. That is important as throughout the Scriptures the bible speaks of YHWH's panyim (Presences) as being his sides. Here are just three verses that express this as well.

Isa 51:5 My righteousness is near, My salvation has gone forth, And My arms will judge the peoples; The coastlands will wait upon Me, And on My arm they will trust.

Isa 63:5 I looked, but there was no one to help, And I wondered That there was no one to uphold; Therefore My own arm brought salvation for Me; And My own fury, it sustained Me.

Jer 27:5 'I have made the earth, the man and the beast that are on the ground, by My great power and by My outstretched arm, and have given it to whom it seemed proper to Me. NKJV

The use of arms in Isa 51:5 is telling and from the Hebrew the word arm represents strength - power, ability to do, from ones side - arm - hand. Therefore when YHWH expresses his ARMS in scripture he is revealing the living distinct presences of Jesus and the Holy Spirit that proceed from the Father to do tasks. Each are co-eternal, co-equal, yet distinct from each other while being of the same essence.

There is no hint in the bible that as you said of Jesus Christ: "In the beginning the eternal Son existed only in the eternal thoughts of the Father as a spiritual embryo," that this concept of yours is NOT even remotely found within the bible.

From what you have written oldman, demonstrates clearly that it is not the true Holy Spirit teaching you as he would never deny who Jesus is by teaching that - "In the beginning the eternal Son existed only in the eternal thoughts of the Father as a spiritual embryo."

Therefore, you do not have the spirit of truth but rather another spirit. Again, if you cannot qualify in simple and easy to understand words who you say the spirit of truth is, then this thread will be locked. Until you answer clearly, no need to ask me anything as you are unwilling to answer by which spirit do you speak about?

You did clarify that the jesus you speak of is a created being - "In the beginning the eternal Son existed only in the eternal thoughts of the Father as a spiritual embryo" so you can easily express whom you claim the spirit of truth is too.

Correct?
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B. W. wrote:if you cannot qualify in simple and easy to understand words who you say the spirit of truth is,

If you cannot acknowledge the essence and character of the Spirit of truth by now, then I can't see you ever will.

B. W. wrote:then this thread will be locked.

Go ahead and lock it then and show your contempt for freedom and truth once more.

Go ahead and lock it then and show your contempt for freedom and truth once more.

Oldman, you may be the only one here to have such opinion about B.W.

Oldman, you may be the only one here to have such opinion about B.W.

You will have to wait and see. See you soon.

http://discussions.godandscience.org/vi ... 26#p154557

oldman wrote:

Oldman, you may be the only one here to have such opinion about B.W.

We shall have to wait and see. See you soon.

http://discussions.godandscience.org/vi ... 26#p154557

Hopefully.