Evidence for God from Science

Can a person be saved by faith alone, without good works that follow?

Hi, I really want to give you a more complete answer, but I am a little bit time-constrained.

In short, the one follows the other. Faith produces works, in the Bible called the fruits of the Holy Spirit. In other words, if you have true faith, the works follow. It is not a question of whether works are required to be saved, a true faith produces works, it is an indicator that your faith is real.

I will attempt to explain more fully later.

Poetic_Soul wrote:Can a person be saved by faith alone, without good works that follow?

http://www.inspirationalstories.com/4/433.html
There was once a bridge which spanned a large river. During most of the day the bridge sat with its length running up and down the river paralleled with the banks, allowing ships to pass thru freely on both sides of the bridge. But at certain times each day, a train would come along and the bridge would be turned sideways across the river, allowing a train to cross it.

A switchman sat in a small shack on one side of the river where he operated the controls to turn the bridge and lock it into place as the train crossed. One evening as the switchman was waiting for the last train of the day to come, he looked off into the distance thru the dimming twilight and caught sight of the trainlights. He stepped to the control and waited until the train was within a prescribed distance when he was to turn the bridge. He turned the bridge into position, but, to his horror, he found the locking control did not work. If the bridge was not securely in position it would wobble back and forth at the ends when the train came onto it, causing the train to jump the track and go crashing into the river. This would be a passenger train with many people aboard.

He left the bridge turned across the river, and hurried across the bridge to the other side of the river where there was a lever switch he could hold to operate the lock manually. He would have to hold the lever back firmly as the train crossed. He could hear the rumble of the train now, and he took hold of the lever and leaned backward to apply his weight to it, locking the bridge. He kept applying the pressure to keep the mechanism locked. Many lives depended on this man's strength.

Then, coming across the bridge from the direction of his control shack, he heard a sound that made his blood run cold. "Daddy, where are you?" His four-year-old son was crossing the bridge to look for him. His first impulse was to cry out to the child, "Run! Run!" But the train was too close; the tiny legs would never make it across the bridge in time. The man almost left his lever to run and snatch up his son and carry him to safety.

But he realized that he could not get back to the lever. Either the people on the train or his little son must die. He took a moment to make his decision. The train sped safely and swiftly on its way, and no one aboard was even aware of the tiny broken body thrown mercilessly into the river by the onrushing train. Nor were they aware of the pitiful figure of the sobbing man, still clinging tightly to the locking lever long after the train had passed.

They did not see him walking home more slowly than he had ever walked: to tell his wife how their son had brutally died.

Now if you were on this train, and found out that this had happened, would you do nothing to repay this man? If so then truly you are not a good person.

Whenever I hear that story, my eye's get misty...

Can a person be saved by faith alone, without good works that follow?

I beleive that faith, without works is dead. (James 2:24)

Blessings and Prayers,
Veronica

Veronica wrote:Whenever I hear that story, my eye's get misty...

Can a person be saved by faith alone, without good works that follow?

I beleive that faith, without works is dead. (James 2:24)

Blessings and Prayers,
Veronica

True!! One without the Other is Dead. But say you only have works! Are you Saved. Nope you need Faith in Jesus Christ as your Saviour to be saved.

bizzt wrote:

Veronica wrote:Whenever I hear that story, my eye's get misty...

Can a person be saved by faith alone, without good works that follow?

I beleive that faith, without works is dead. (James 2:24)

Blessings and Prayers,
Veronica

True!! One without the Other is Dead. But say you only have works! Are you Saved. Nope you need Faith in Jesus Christ as your Saviour to be saved.

Obviously we disagree here.
But don't get me wrong I am not saying you are wrong.
=)

But I pose this question.
Did Jesus need faith in Jesus in order to do works, and be saved?

If a person is saved by Faith, good works should naturally follow.

bizzt wrote: True!! One without the Other is Dead. But say you only have works! Are you Saved. Nope you need Faith in Jesus Christ as your Saviour to be saved.

I agree. You can't have one without the other.
"The disciple of Christ must not only keep the faith and live on it, but also profess it, confidently bear witness to it, and spread it..." (Catechism of the Church, #1816)

bizzt wrote: True!! One without the Other is Dead. But say you only have works! Are you Saved. Nope you need Faith in Jesus Christ as your Saviour to be saved.

I agree. You can't have one without the other.

"The disciple of Christ must not only keep the faith and live on it, but also profess it, confidently bear witness to it, and spread it..." (Catechism of the Church, #1816)

"Paul, joining righteousness to faith and weaving them together, constructs of them the breastplates for the infantryman, armoring the soldier properly and safely on both sides. A soldier cannot be considered safely armored when either shield is disjoined from the other. Faith without works of justice is not sufficient for salvation; neither is righteous living secure in itself of salvation, if it is disjoined from faith" (Homilies on Ecclesiastes 8 [ca. A.D. 335- 394]). Gregory of Nyssa


Blessings and Prayers,
Veronica

BGoodForGoodSake wrote:

bizzt wrote:

Veronica wrote:Whenever I hear that story, my eye's get misty...

Can a person be saved by faith alone, without good works that follow?

I beleive that faith, without works is dead. (James 2:24)

Blessings and Prayers,
Veronica

True!! One without the Other is Dead. But say you only have works! Are you Saved. Nope you need Faith in Jesus Christ as your Saviour to be saved.

Obviously we disagree here.
But don't get me wrong I am not saying you are wrong.
=)

But I pose this question.
Did Jesus need faith in Jesus in order to do works, and be saved?

That is like saying Can God Create a Rock that is too heavy for him to lift

bizzt wrote:

BGoodForGoodSake wrote:

bizzt wrote:True!! One without the Other is Dead. But say you only have works! Are you Saved. Nope you need Faith in Jesus Christ as your Saviour to be saved.

Obviously we disagree here.
But don't get me wrong I am not saying you are wrong.
=)

But I pose this question.
Did Jesus need faith in Jesus in order to do works, and be saved?

That is like saying Can God Create a Rock that is too heavy for him to lift

Ok, then what about this what of the people before like Adam and Moses. How can they be saved if they had no chance to know Christ?

Poetic_Soul wrote:Can a person be saved by faith alone, without good works that follow?

Yes.

There's only one example of this...and that is the example of the Thief on the cross. He had no works to back up his faith...that we are told of. He accepted Christ and then (presumably) died thereafter. (there's room for other interpretations too...)

It is a rare instance, but it can happen. For the most part, I would agree that works are a fruit of faith...they come naturally.
.
.

BGoodForGoodSake wrote:But I pose this question.
Did Jesus need faith in Jesus in order to do works, and be saved?

I think bizzt is fairly correct in pointing out this to be illogical question like the rock question. For if to be saved is to be with God despite our having committed sin, and Jesus is God, then essentially you're asking whether Jesus, who is God, needs faith in himself to be forgiven of his sin (or sinlessness) in order to be with himself. Obviously a person can't not be with themselves, since they are themself.

Also it isn't necessarily that faith in Christ is required "to do" works, but rather the decision to accept Christ's forgiveness and follow after Him is void of any meaning if one continues to not thinking twice about their wrong actions and try to change.

There are also two ways to salvation according to Christianity. Complete righteousness, or through Christ. We must take our pick.

Kurieuo

Kurieuo wrote:

BGoodForGoodSake wrote:But I pose this question.
Did Jesus need faith in Jesus in order to do works, and be saved?

I think bizzt is fairly correct in pointing out this to be illogical question like the rock question. For if to be saved is to be with God despite our having committed sin, and Jesus is God, then essentially you're asking whether Jesus, who is God, needs faith in himself to be forgiven of his sin (or sinlessness) in order to be with himself. Obviously a person can't not be with themselves, since they are themself.

Also it isn't necessarily that faith in Christ is required "to do" works, but rather the decision to accept Christ's forgiveness and follow after Him is void of any meaning if one continues to not thinking twice about their wrong actions and try to change.

There are also two ways to salvation according to Christianity. Complete righteousness, or through Christ. We must take our pick.

Kurieuo

If you notice, Jesus did have faith. In us. While we were yet sinners; he still went to the cross.

Good works is acting out your faith. Many people profess their faith but how many show their faith by good works.

Good works is also a justification of who and whose you are. You ever notice who gets the glory when good works come into effect? Who gets the honor? You can tell a christian by who gets the glory and honor.

Jesus' good works was always given to the Father.

Noah had to build an ark.
Abraham had to leave his father, sacrifice his son.
Moses had to face Pharoah.
Rehab gave up her community.

These are all acts of faith through work.

BGoodForGoodSake wrote:

bizzt wrote:

BGoodForGoodSake wrote:

bizzt wrote:True!! One without the Other is Dead. But say you only have works! Are you Saved. Nope you need Faith in Jesus Christ as your Saviour to be saved.

Obviously we disagree here.
But don't get me wrong I am not saying you are wrong.
=)

But I pose this question.
Did Jesus need faith in Jesus in order to do works, and be saved?

That is like saying Can God Create a Rock that is too heavy for him to lift

Ok, then what about this what of the people before like Adam and Moses. How can they be saved if they had no chance to know Christ?

Did they not know God? They believed in the Saviour to Come and Therefore were Justified onto Righteousness. It is not always Cut and Dry but just the same it is! For Example the Indians who did not know Jesus. Are they saved? Whether it be on Earth or in Heaven you will be judged! And like K said you can either stand on your own Righteousness before God or on Jesus before God. Whom will you Serve? Yourself or Jesus?