Evidence for God from Science

Okay, I have been hearing more and SEEING more of this lately, but what is the deal with this Christmas Controversy? I heard on the radio that million/billionaire secularists are pouring their money into the ACLU and other anti-religious organizations to have Christmas banned. Christmas trees are now called holiday trees, no more saying and displaying Merry Christmas allowed as there will be an outrage. I feel that secularists + the media (which drive the secularists) is causing this to get worse. We are a Christian nation. All these people who come into America and are offended by Merry Christmas because they don't like that maybe should go back, and the secularists want to neutralize it to make it fair for both sides, but if they do that, then there is no Christmas, just Happy Holidays, which is secular.

What do you think will happen since the secular organizations and the media are driving to get Christmas banned?

I think it will be. I find that I am viewed increasingly negatively by non-Christians. People almost cringe when they hear anything about Jesus, the bible, Christianity.

I also find it strange that others of different religions are treated with respect (Islam, Jews, etc.), but Christians are shunned. I have been poked fun at for wearing Jesus bracelets. As if Christianity is a delusion or a disease.

But, the bible does say we will be increasingly persecuted in the end. I think we are in the End of Days.

Mystical wrote:I think it will be. I find that I am viewed increasingly negatively by non-Christians. People almost cringe when they hear anything about Jesus, the bible, Christianity.

I also find it strange that others of different religions are treated with respect (Islam, Jews, etc.), but Christians are shunned. I have been poked fun at for wearing Jesus bracelets. As if Christianity is a delusion or a disease.

But, the bible does say we will be increasingly persecuted in the end. I think we are in the End of Days.

I double that. Jesus knew it would happen, the more something fits with a religion, the more real it becomes, case in point, Christianity. Now I know why many will not enter Heaven. Atheists are getting their way through ANY form necessary and succeeding. These stores I go to have evolution banners to promote the holidays on their websites. Everything is being replaced, people are getting meaner, the list goes on...

Very horrible and very scary. Truth scares people. I think they know its the truth deep in their hearts and that is why we are being so increasingly and savagely shunned.

Not that I know much about this, but is it even possible to ban Christmas?? as in, make it illegal to celebrate it?


Or do you just mean stop Christmas from being a national holiday?

Thinker, we are now living in what has become called the age of "post-modernism", and you will find these things you describe happen increasingly.

Post-modernism has as it's features beliefs that:
- truth does not exist objectively; it is a product of a person's culture
- humans are primarily social beings, products of the culture and environment
- life on Earth is fragile, and the enlightenment model of the human conquest of nature must quickly give way to a new attitude of cooperation with the Earth
- thinking is a "social construct", language is arbitary, and there is no universal truth transcending culture
- progress is an oppressive Western concept

Compare that to Ethical theism:
- truth has been revealed to men and women by God
- humans are both spiritual and material beings, created in God's image but fallen because of sin
- God is the Creator, Preserver, and Governor of His Earth and has instructed humans to subdue it and care for it
- reason can disclose truth about reality but faith and revelation are needed in addition
- human history is not progressing but awaiting deliverance

(Josh McDowell in "The New Evidence That Demands a Verdict", 1999)

One of the things that concerns me greatly is the effect of the liberal left in their efforts not to offend anyone, through exercising their tyranny of political correctness, of progressively ridding us of our Judeo-Christian cultural heritage. In doing so, they are creating a cultural vacuum that lays us wide open to invasion by more aggressive ideologies. There is evidence of this process already underway in countries where post-modernism is rampant.

The ideology that concerns me most is Islam. The name “Islam” means “submission” - submission to Allah. The objective of Islam is world wide dominance - whole world submission to Allah.

As we continue to weaken ourselves culturally through political correctness, denigrating and spurning our own heritage, we are inviting Islam to come and live with us and when they are ready, to turn and take us for their own. We offer no cultural resistance as we are so busy pleasing everyone else, taking care not to offend them with our own customs and traditions.

Here is the link to my Journal (part of my website) if you are interested in these subjects.

The issue about Christmas...

Can you find anywhere in the Bible where you are instructed to observe and celebrate Christ's birthday?

Also, some Christians do not celebrate it at all on the grounds that it is a pagan festival - the date of December 25 coinciding with the birth of Attis, a Phrygian cult of the sun-god, introduced into Rome under the Empire. It is also the celebration of Saturnalia, a cult of the god Saturn. And Tammuz, son of the Sun, was also born on 25 December. These are pagan gods.
The date of Jesus' birth is not actually known although it is pretty certain that He was not born of 25 December. Some have calculated fairly logically that it was more likely sometime in September.

If you are interested, you might like to read the following papers:
http://www.swrb.com/newslett/actualNLs?Xmas_ch2.htm
(If you get a message declining you permission to read this article, Google the words "Kevin Reed Christmas" and it will provide an unbroken link for you.)
http://www.dccsa.com/greatjoy/C&E.htm
And the one that I find presents a very sensible position:
http://members.aol.com/basfawlty/chrmas.htm

its just political correctness gone too far. everyone in the business world is absolutely terrified of offending people. there's no huge conspiracy to rid the world of christmas, its just no one wants some ultra-sensitive person on the TV saying how some company discrimiates against them or end up in court. court cases look bad, no matter how frivolous they are.

Yes, it is all about multiculturalism, relativism and political correctness - these being a part of today's "post-modern" philosophy.

It is being said that none of us can actually know reality directly. What we know is only our perception or experience of reality - not the actual reality itself. What we perceive of reality is so influenced by social and cultural aspects of ourselves that we cannot know the real truth of reality. How you experience something is going to be different from how I experience something because of our many individual differences that are culturally or socially influenced.

Therefore... your perception of reality is true for you, and my perception of reality is true for me.
That being so, we can hold different views and both be considered right.

In this world of so many cultures, and according to this philosophy, since there are so many "right" ways of perceiving reality (even although they can be contradictory) we must allow everyone their own perception without judging it falsely to be wrong. Everything goes, and nothing should be allowed to appear more "true" than anything else.

Christmas is a Christian thing, but the beliefs contained in Christianity are only one perception of reality - and a non-Christian's beliefs are to be considered just as valid, so must not be discounted.
The non-Christian does not believe in the events of Christmas in the same way, so we must be sensitive to his position and "neutralize" Christmas accordingly so as not to offend him.
We must be "politically correct" and take Christmas out of Christmas.

Well, that is something like how the thinking goes.

So it is not really any conspiracy or plot as such. It is a product of a philosophy that has currently invaded Western civilization.

It is a philosophy that I personally cannot agree with, and I see it as self-defeating and simply wrong.
But there are a large number of folks that do go along with it.

Like all of these philosophies that have emerged through history and then been overtaken and replaced by newer ones, this one will probably go the same way... and something else will dominate our thinking and our lives.

Meantime, we are supposed to remove the Christian message from Christmas (to be "politically correct" for these times) and in doing so render it defunct.

Firstly, I really don't see how it could be banned, as such is an incringement upon freedom, something the US is often portrayed as upholding. Secondly, businesses would stand to loose money. People spend money at Christmas to buy gifts and so forth, xmas movies are made around Santa Claus, elves, and what-have-you. Atheists are just going to be seen as scrooges and so much the worse for them if they attempt such a feat.

My thoughts are Christians would celebrate Christmas in any case. And if something like a legal banning was possible, which I sincerely doubt, it might infact put the meaning back into Christmas since it has been largely commercialised with Santa Claus and so forth, and the "meaning" of Christmas which is often described as something divorced from Christ.

Kurieuo

You might even say that it would not be politically correct to ban Christmas since it would be offensive to Christians to do so.
After all, our perception of reality is at least equal in validity to that of anyone else.

Nobody's gonna cancel christmas, that's just silly.

I think it's very plausible that the Christian version of Christmas could get banned. Not a ridiculous idea at all.

Chrismas could not be banned. it could no longer be a federal holiday, but if that happened, you would probably have a very large number of government workers going on strike.

I'm an Atheist and probably will always be but banning christmas......WHY? Why can't people realise everyone can't believe in the same things.

No offence anyone but why do people have to overreact so much, cant they let peopel celebrate what they want, im offended by what terrorist do but they still do it.