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Vatican wants to end battle with science

Posted: Mon Dec 12, 2005 1:38 am
by Believer
Before you read the article provided below, please read this quote I extracted from it, it is as follows:
Monsignor Gianfranco Basti, director of the Vatican project STOQ, or Science, Theology and Ontological Quest, reaffirmed John Paul's 1996 statement that evolution was “more than just a hypothesis.”

“A hypothesis asks whether something is true or false,” he said. “(Evolution) is more than a hypothesis because there is proof.”
Is there proof as outlined above, and is the article below factual or was it misinterpreted to appear factual?
MSNBC.com wrote:Image MSNBC.com

Vatican wants to end battle with science
Cardinal says unreasonable religion can fall prey to fundamentalism


The Associated Press
Updated: 3:16 p.m. ET Nov. 3, 2005

VATICAN CITY - A Vatican cardinal said Thursday that the faithful should listen to what secular modern science has to offer, warning that religion risks turning into “fundamentalism” if it ignores scientific reason.

Cardinal Paul Poupard, who heads the Pontifical Council for Culture, made the comments at a news conference on a Vatican project to help end the “mutual prejudice” between religion and science that has long bedeviled the Roman Catholic Church and is part of the evolution debate in the United States.

The Vatican project was inspired by Pope John Paul II's 1992 declaration that the church's 17th-century denunciation of Galileo was an error resulting from “tragic mutual incomprehension.” Galileo was condemned for supporting Nicolaus Copernicus' discovery that the earth revolved around the sun; church teaching at the time placed Earth at the center of the universe.

“The permanent lesson that the Galileo case represents pushes us to keep alive the dialogue between the various disciplines, and in particular between theology and the natural sciences, if we want to prevent similar episodes from repeating themselves in the future,” Poupard said.

Are scientists listening?
But he said science, too, should listen to religion.

“We know where scientific reason can end up by itself: The atomic bomb and the possibility of cloning human beings are fruit of a reason that wants to free itself from every ethical or religious link,” he said.

“But we also know the dangers of a religion that severs its links with reason and becomes prey to fundamentalism,” he said. “The faithful have the obligation to listen to that which secular modern science has to offer, just as we ask that knowledge of the faith be taken in consideration as an expert voice in humanity.”

Views on intelligent-design debate
Poupard and others at the news conference were asked about the religion-science debate raging in the United States over evolution and “intelligent design.”

Intelligent design's supporters argue that natural selection, an element of evolutionary theory, cannot fully explain the origin of life or the emergence of highly complex life forms.

Monsignor Gianfranco Basti, director of the Vatican project STOQ, or Science, Theology and Ontological Quest, reaffirmed John Paul's 1996 statement that evolution was “more than just a hypothesis.”

“A hypothesis asks whether something is true or false,” he said. “(Evolution) is more than a hypothesis because there is proof.”

He was asked about comments made in July by Austrian Cardinal Christoph Schoenborn, who dismissed in a New York Times article the 1996 statement by John Paul as “rather vague and unimportant” and seemed to back intelligent design.

Basti concurred that John Paul's 1996 letter “is not a very clear expression from a definition point of view,” but he said evolution was assuming ever more authority as scientific proof develops.

Poupard, for his part, stressed that what was important was that “the universe wasn't made by itself, but has a creator.” But he added, “It's important for the faithful to know how science views things to understand better.”

The Vatican project STOQ has organized academic courses and conferences on the relationship between science and religion and is hosting its first international conference on “the infinity in science, philosophy and theology,” next week.

SOURCE: CLICK HERE

Posted: Mon Dec 12, 2005 10:23 am
by sandy_mcd
Belief in evolution is not a tenet of Catholicism, but the Church does seem to be making a recent effort to show that evolution is not in conflict with the Church's teachings. I think some of this is in response to Cardinal Schonborn's statement which seemed to suggest a shift towards ID; August disagrees with my thoughts about the cardinal.

Posted: Mon Dec 12, 2005 10:45 am
by August
sandy_mcd wrote:Belief in evolution is not a tenet of Catholicism, but the Church does seem to be making a recent effort to show that evolution is not in conflict with the Church's teachings. I think some of this is in response to Cardinal Schonborn's statement which seemed to suggest a shift towards ID; August disagrees with my thoughts about the cardinal.
:)

I believe what the Cardinal said, quoting Pope John Paul II, was that they could not agree with a completely naturalistic version of evolution, but could agree with theistic evolution. So it depends which version of evolution we are talking about, whether the RCC accepts it or not.
http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/05654a.htm

Posted: Mon Dec 12, 2005 10:57 am
by numeral2_5
sandy_mcd wrote:Belief in evolution is not a tenet of Catholicism, but the Church does seem to be making a recent effort to show that evolution is not in conflict with the Church's teachings. I think some of this is in response to Cardinal Schonborn's statement which seemed to suggest a shift towards ID; August disagrees with my thoughts about the cardinal.
I appreciate the Vatican's openmindedness.

Posted: Mon Dec 12, 2005 2:44 pm
by Jbuza
A hypothesis asks whether something is true or false


No it doesn't, it askes wether or not what we decide to study reveals observations that indicate that the hypothesis could be true. That is a huge difference numerous hypothesis could be devised that could explain an observation.

But if you are trying to spread an idea than trying to convince peoplpe that it is Truth is a good idea. Perhaps there are some who are actually duped by thinking that explanation=Truth.

Posted: Mon Dec 12, 2005 5:21 pm
by BGoodForGoodSake
Jbuza wrote:A hypothesis asks whether something is true or false


No it doesn't, it askes wether or not what we decide to study reveals observations that indicate that the hypothesis could be true. That is a huge difference numerous hypothesis could be devised that could explain an observation.
A good hypothesis is one which poses an experiment which can prove an idea wrong.
Jbuza wrote:But if you are trying to spread an idea than trying to convince peoplpe that it is Truth is a good idea. Perhaps there are some who are actually duped by thinking that explanation=Truth.
You are right about this, a scientific theory is only an idea which has yet to be disproven.

Posted: Mon Dec 12, 2005 6:42 pm
by Jbuza
BGoodForGoodSake wrote:
Jbuza wrote:A hypothesis asks whether something is true or false


No it doesn't, it askes wether or not what we decide to study reveals observations that indicate that the hypothesis could be true. That is a huge difference numerous hypothesis could be devised that could explain an observation.
A good hypothesis is one which poses an experiment which can prove an idea wrong.
Again I disagree. It doesn't proove the idea wrong it proves the hypothesis wrong, which may seem like a fine line, but if punctuated equilibrium was proved wrong evolution would dust itself off and continue.

Posted: Mon Dec 12, 2005 7:09 pm
by Mystical
What proof? Where's the proof? Besides, Galileo wasn't condemned for supporting Corpernicus' discovery. I read somewhere (don't remember where) that he was condemned for mocking the Pope and demanding that the church grant his discovery immediate credence (instead of allowing the public to accept it at their pace).