Evidence for God from Science

Looking back on who I've been throughout my life often brings me close to tears. Through the wisdom, love, and forgiveness within the Bible I've found myself changing in major ways. I used to be a musician and a songwriter but I've now dropped that for the sake of humility; my ego had inflated so much that I no longer knew who I was anymore. I do things for people now, care for them as fellow friends struggling through life. I try to offer advice to anyone with an open mind and hope that they will understand my intentions. Christianity is working within me like a wrecking ball on a decaying house. Each day several bad traits and habits are wiped away and replaced by a simple love for everything.

Do you think that the love defined within the Bible is what makes people fear christianity in this sarcastic age? Love and respect is no longer valued by the youth. I know this because I've grown up in the last ten years with people who sharpen their sarcastic wit and are proud of this.

Atticus Finch wrote:Looking back on who I've been throughout my life often brings me close to tears. Through the wisdom, love, and forgiveness within the Bible I've found myself changing in major ways. I used to be a musician and a songwriter but I've now dropped that for the sake of humility; my ego had inflated so much that I no longer knew who I was anymore. I do things for people now, care for them as fellow friends struggling through life. I try to offer advice to anyone with an open mind and hope that they will understand my intentions. Christianity is working within me like a wrecking ball on a decaying house. Each day several bad traits and habits are wiped away and replaced by a simple love for everything.

Do you think that the love defined within the Bible is what makes people fear christianity in this sarcastic age? Love and respect is no longer valued by the youth. I know this because I've grown up in the last ten years with people who sharpen their sarcastic wit and are proud of this.

I think there may some truth in this. Skepticism does resist pure innocence and love.

Welcome to our board.

What is your position on the Person of Jesus and how do you see your relationship to Him?

Bart

Yeah, welcome to the board! It's a good thing to care for people. God works mighty changes in a person's heart... I think it isn't bad to write songs, in itself...poetry has often helped people. You could try your hand at writing songs praising God -- I'm sure people around here wouldn't mind commenting on them! However, let your conscience decide.

I recognize myself in your story -- recently (yesterday? the day before?) I suddenly noticed that whenever a person would give me some place in his/her life (especially 'her' life, come to think of it ), I would automatically assume I now had a center place in that person's life, and I would feel offended if I saw that somebody else was given a similar place.
But then I saw that, given the things I've done or thought without regard to the love those people had given me, I did not even deserve to know them... It's God's mercy that we have been placed in a community, because a person needs others before he can fully live... So if I didn't even deserve to see them, I shouldn't selfishly claim first place in their lives.
What you say, and what God has always said, is true. Only humility -- serving others -- makes a man really alive.

That's my experience... I hope it helps anyone, and if not, it's still good to talk about it.

May I ask why you called yourself 'Atticus Finch'? It's a cool name!

Canuckster1127 wrote:
What is your position on the Person of Jesus and how do you see your relationship to Him?

Bart

I'm not quite sure yet. I've been greeted with what I'd consider naive requests to "accept Jesus as my Lord and Savior" at once. I turned down these requests thinking that merely saying words that entertain theology which I cannot fully grasp yet won't do a thing. I've read the gospel accounts of Jesus' life and am certain that if there is one truth to being then Jesus Christ had it and told it.

I can recognize the deep truth within every word recorded of his. The parables reach deep within me and unfold a new truth each time I read them. I can't yet say that I can call him my God because at this point it would almost seem like wishful thinking on my part. I'm surrounded by atheists who mock christianity at every chance they get and it's very hard to recall a positive view from that.

Atticus Finch wrote:

Canuckster1127 wrote:
What is your position on the Person of Jesus and how do you see your relationship to Him?

Bart

I'm not quite sure yet. I've been greeted with what I'd consider naive requests to "accept Jesus as my Lord and Savior" at once. I turned down these requests thinking that merely saying words that entertain theology which I cannot fully grasp yet won't do a thing. I've read the gospel accounts of Jesus' life and am certain that if there is one truth to being then Jesus Christ had it and told it.

I can recognize the deep truth within every word recorded of his. The parables reach deep within me and unfold a new truth each time I read them. I can't yet say that I can call him my God because at this point it would almost seem like wishful thinking on my part. I'm surrounded by atheists who mock christianity at every chance they get and it's very hard to recall a positive view from that.

Atticus, since you've read the gospels, do you understand the offer that Jesus presents to you?

FFC wrote: Atticus, since you've read the gospels, do you understand the offer that Jesus presents to you?

I do but (and I hate to say this) I'm not sure if I can "buy" it.

I'm confronted with too many doubts about an afterlife (and confusing descriptions of one) that leads me to believe that Christianity might be a neat way to live but nothing more.

"Or ever the silver cord be loosed, or the golden bowl be broken, or the pitcher be broken at the fountain, or the wheel broken at the cistern." Eccls 12:6

I've heard people say that the "silver cord" is what holds the soul to the body, and the "golden bowl" the halo of some kind which maintains itself around our heads. Sometimes this whole thing appeals to me and makes sense, other times it sounds ridiculous and like a fairy tale.

Atticus wrote:I do but (and I hate to say this) I'm not sure if I can "buy" it.

I'm confronted with too many doubts about an afterlife (and confusing descriptions of one) that leads me to believe that Christianity might be a neat way to live but nothing more.

Well at least your honest. What kind of doubts are you having that are keeping you from believing in Jesus for eternal life? Maybe we can help you sort them out. Also I'm sure you know that there are a lot of excellent resources available out there that deal with the tough questions that skeptics ask.

Take care

FFC wrote:
What kind of doubts are you having that are keeping you from believing in Jesus for eternal life?

I find it hard to believe John 3:16 as the only way to eternal life. I can understand the "Prodigal Son" aspect of John 3:16 that God rejoices when a person turns to Him, but many people who receive Jesus don't abandon their sin and continue to live as terrible people. When I read of John the Baptist's preaching about God, I don't hear "Say you love Jesus but still continue to live as badly as you already do..." but rather "Abandon your sins now and turn your life to God!" which is a beautiful thing.

It's no secret that the typical american christian is an ignorant bigot and this is why the secular world has no respect for christianity. This only speaks about the people and not the true beauty of the faith. But what this says to me is an injustice for all good people upon their death. It seems that simply "accepting" Jesus Christ as Lord is a doorway to a better life HERE and in the life AFTER this one. Similar to John the Baptist's teachings about turning to God. I interpret it in the same light: Accept Jesus and turn your life to Him as well as you can.

Is this the view held by the majority here or am I far from the truth?

I've read of serial killers who when faced with the electric chair have suddenly become converts to christianity. Now I can understand how this might work since it's in the light of the "Prodigal Son" sort of thing. I understand that a man might convert to christianity, accept Jesus Christ and that day turn from his sins; yet he might be hit by a car as he leaves his home. Of course this shows the logic in simply accepting Jesus Christ because we could die at any time, but it doesn't give us a free pass (in my mind) to be awful to each other and sin away with a "get out of jail free" pass through Jesus.

As people seem to say, it's not good deeds that give eternal life but faith in Jesus Christ. People seem to interpret this as meaning that anything goes as long as Jesus has been accepted (even if it was at age 5 when nobody really has a clue what it's all about.)

I'm sorry for ranting away there, it's late and I'm generally confused about my views on this issue. I'd greatly appreciate some clarification if possible. I'd love to turn my life to the way and word of Jesus Christ but with these obstacles in the way it's difficult.

Upon reading the Epistle of James I've found an answer to some of my confusion. I should seek answers in the Bible first and foremost before I just start releasing questions onto every helpful person.

James 1:22: "But be ye doers of the word and not hearers only, deceiving your own selves."

And a truly beautiful verse in 1:27: "Pure religion and undefiled before God and the Father is this, To visit the fatherless and widows in their affliction, and to keep himself unspotted by the world. "

Is it that we are to accept Jesus Christ as our Savior and Lord in the promise of eternal life and freedom from the slavery of sin and to also live with our fellow people as He told us to in love?

The above makes HEAPS of sense to me and it's a shame that people cannot fully turn themselves over to Christ in both word and deed.

You summed that up beautifully. But don't tell Jac -- he would disagree with you!

However, only faith in Jesus Christ will save a person and ensure his eternal life. This is called justification. Jesus asks anyone who is tired and burdened of wrongdoing to come to Him. However, He will also change a person from the inside. This is called sanctification. Many people (like Jac on this board) believe that 'faith' in the Bible means 'faith' and there is no difference between 'saving faith' (which produces an inward change -- a desire to live in a holy way) and 'spurious faith' (which doesn't produce such a change, and is self-deception, according to us).

However, it's not our works that save us; grace does, and grace comes through faith.

We have died with Christ, and Christ lives in us now.

About your questions on the afterlife: that's not merely a happy delusion, whatever the skeptics may say. Jesus talked a lot about it, and as He is the only person who has ever come back from the dead, He should be able to talk about it, eh?

Atticus Finch wrote:Upon reading the Epistle of James I've found an answer to some of my confusion. I should seek answers in the Bible first and foremost before I just start releasing questions onto every helpful person.

James 1:22: "But be ye doers of the word and not hearers only, deceiving your own selves."

And a truly beautiful verse in 1:27: "Pure religion and undefiled before God and the Father is this, To visit the fatherless and widows in their affliction, and to keep himself unspotted by the world. "

Is it that we are to accept Jesus Christ as our Savior and Lord in the promise of eternal life and freedom from the slavery of sin and to also live with our fellow people as He told us to in love?

The above makes HEAPS of sense to me and it's a shame that people cannot fully turn themselves over to Christ in both word and deed.

Very good. I wholeheartedly agree! Now if Jesus is who He said He is and did for you what He came to do than what could hinder you from believing , wholly relying, and clinging to him for everlasting life?

I can't judge whether some of those in your previous post truly believed. All I know is Jesus is the way the truth and the life and nobody comes to the Father but by Him (John 14:6)

There are jerks and hypocrites in all walks of life, secular and Christian alike and many times I am one of them, but to let their actions stand in the way of you totally surrendering to Jesus and his offer of eternal life is crazy. If a true Christian walks in a way that is a stumbling block to non believers, be assured that God will surely deal with them. God doesn't just save us and then we are on our own to keep His word in our own strength. He saves us and makes us his Child. He guides us as children and even chastises us as children. True disciples walk in his ways and grow in faith every day...unfortunately some get lazy and don't. God will deal with them.