Evidence for God from Science

Dear all,

I am pretty perplexed about the belief in Christ in particular thinking of those who are insane, psychopath and of unsound mind; are they saved? Notably they can't understand the scripture; even though they are preached they can't possibly grasp what you say and it seems virtually there's no hope for them to be redeemed. In John gospel, one has to be reborn to be saved; it occurs to me these group of people are doomed and in despair. If so, why should the Lord create them or let them be so? They are also human being, creatures that God bless and descendents from Adam and Eve by definition.

I ain't sure if anyone has asked before; if this topic repeats itself I beg your pardon indeed.


Oriental.

Oriental wrote:Dear all,

I am pretty perplexed about the belief in Christ in particular thinking of those who are insane, psychopath and of unsound mind; are they saved? Notably they can't understand the scripture; even though they are preached they can't possibly grasp what you say and it seems virtually there's no hope for them to be redeemed. In John gospel, one has to be reborn to be saved; it occurs to me these group of people are doomed and in despair. If so, why should the Lord create them or let them be so? They are also human being, creatures that God bless and descendents from Adam and Eve by definition.

I ain't sure if anyone has asked before; if this topic repeats itself I beg your pardon indeed.


Oriental.

We have discussed similar lines in the past, but that is fine.

Usually this question comes up also with regard to aborted children, stillborn or the death of a child before what some have termed, "the age of accountibility" which refers to a specific point in time in which a child passes from innocence to being capable and accountible for the decisions they make before God.

Frankly, the Bible doesn't address it clearly, at least not in the terms which this question frames it.

Some look to Jesus' statements with regard to "suffer the little children to come unto me" as an indication that he specifically cares for them in this regard as well. I think that is a true thought in some regard but it clearly was not the context of the passage and we need to be careful in terms of how we interpret Scripture to try and make it say something we want rather than what it is truly saying.

Some take a very hard line, such as you suggest, that in the absence of capacity to receive Christ there is no salvation. It's tied somewhat to one's view of the nature of God and how God provides salvation. Calvinists for example, as they see salvation tied to a work of the Holy Spirit that comes before we make a decision, would see it in terms of whether that child or incpacitated person who is mentally the equivilent of a child was predestined or elect. Those who are not purely calvinist tend to fall more into the age of accountibility type belief that God'd justice and fairness would not condemn someone incapable of making a decision.

I'm content to admit, I don't know. I do know that God is just, loving and sovereign however and I'm completely comfortable trusting that none of these situations surprise Him and that He knew that the fall of man would result in consequences such as mental illness, mental retardation and children dying. The problem in my mind tends to come when we elevate one of the attributes of God, such as Sovereignty, Love or Mercy etc. and try to make it the "master" attribute that trumps all else. God is infinite and there is an elements of mystery to His person and ways. I am finite, and I can understand what God reveals to a point, but there often will be situations, such as this one, that perplex me and for which I can find no completely satisfying answer. So, I look to God's Word. I try to understand what I can based on what He has revealed. I admit to God and myself when I can't competely work it out. Then I return to square one. I believe in God and trust Him to do what is right for His own reasons and within the realm of his perfect Holiness.

I hope this helps some.

Bart

Hi Oriental,
This is a question I'm sure every person, Christian or not, has asked at some point in their lives. There is not a lot of clear cut scripture for us in this area as Bart pointed out, but there is a lot about the nature and charactor of God in the bible.

All I know is that it is responding to God's call to believe in his Son for everlasting life that assures Salvation, because it is God who does the saving. In my opinion the Lord God Almighty is able to reach and communicate with anybody anywhere regardless of age, location, or mental capacity. With God all things are possible!

If my memory serves, Jesus was ever questioned about the same thing. Is it in the Gospel according to John? Someone asked Jesus what fault a blind man had committed that made him blind after birth. Jesus replied that no one sin, but it was for God to reveal His purpose and mercy over us.

Right?


Oriental.

Oriental wrote:If my memory serves, Jesus was ever questioned about the same thing. Is it in the Gospel according to John? Someone asked Jesus what fault a blind man had committed that made him blind after birth. Jesus replied that no one sin, but it was for God to reveal His purpose and mercy over us.

Right?


Oriental.

Yes. You have the essence of that passage. That was speaking of suffering in that regard I believe.

Now I find it:

John 9:1-3:

As he went along, he saw a man blind from birth. His disciples asked him. "Rabbi, who sinned, this man or his parents, that he was born blind?"

Neither this man nor his parents sinned, "said Jesus, "but this happened so that the work of God might be displayed in his life."




Oriental.