Evidence for God from Science

I sent this as a PM to Canuckster, but he said he was not the best person to talk to; I think it would benefit me to post it here:

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Responses are welcome.

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Hmmm...don't exactly know what to say, however I do know that with continued prayer and the intent on your part to please God first, the situation will either become clear to you what God wants you to do, or with God's help you'll be able to bear this burden.

For what it's worth, I hope these feeble words help in some small way.
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Harry12345 wrote:I sent this as a PM to Canuckster, but he said he was not the best person to talk to; I think it would benefit me to post it here:


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Responses are welcome.

Harry,

we have talked before about sexuality and I at least understand a part of the frustration. You compare heterosexual love and envy and there is a real frustration in not being able to acheive that level of intimacy and love. There is, at the heart, an element of "it's not fair" about the problem.

Remember, I am a CHristian single woman in her thirties and have been struggling with this idea that "they" (heterosexual couples) get to express their love and achieve an intimacy that is not in my life. But simply because I desire that love and intimacy does not make my sinning (ie, if I go out and find a relationship with, say, a non-Christian man, or a relationship i nvolving sex, or even a relationship involving innappropriate emotional involvement, which can happen!) right. All it can do is make that sinning perhaps more understandable. I find in supremely frustrating currently going to churches and being saturated with married couples.

I have not done any word studies, but I have not understood any scripture regarding sin to somehow separate "love" and "lust". For instance, we don't see anything regarding sexual relationships as long as they love each other. Sexuality is very carefully limited in scripture to marriage. Without that sexual intmacy we really are left with friendships. The problem I see with your question (can we achieve that level of intimacy without sexual relatiohsips) is that it would be fraught with temptations. It would be akin to me have a strong emotional realtionship with a guy and believe me, that is fraugh with problems. Inevitably, one of the persons in the relationship has some element of attraction. I;m not saying it can't be done, but you have to think of the future, are you talking about you have a relationship with another homosexual without sex?

But part of the cure for that desire, after, of course, prayer, is the seeking of good CHristian friends who can keep you accountable. Part of my frustration is my age, being in th thirties, most women in churches are married and I don't have much in common. I can see where you would experie4nce that as well. But it is worth the struggle. FInd strong churches who have good small groups where you can develop an intimacy that can help assuage that loneliness, believe me, I can understand that part....

Hope this is in some way encouraging.

But simply because I desire that love and intimacy does not make my sinning (ie, if I go out and find a relationship with, say, a non-Christian man, or a relationship i nvolving sex, or even a relationship involving innappropriate emotional involvement, which can happen!) right.

I don't understand what point you're trying to make: you starting an intimate (but non-sexual) relationship with a non-Christian man is undoubtably sinful, because we aren't supposed to get too close to non-believers. But if I were to start an intimate (but non-sexual) relationship with a Christian homosexual man, the issue would be a little less clear cut. By your logic your answer to the question is 'yes' my desire is sinful.

FInd strong churches who have good small groups where you can develop an intimacy that can help assuage that loneliness

The scale of love and intimacy between two Church friends is totally different to the scale of love and intimacy between a married couple. Check out Genesis:

"It is not good that man should be alone"

Taken from http://www.reapteam.org/were-adam-and-eve-married:

"None of us were meant to fight through life on our own. And, God's plan isn't that we just have nice, close friends to help us along, although this is part of His plan. But there's more — He wants us to experience total unity with someone."

It is God's plan to have a soul mate to bear the burden of life and to encounter and overcome problems with. It is God's plan to be totally open and intimate with someone else, to feel like we trust them completely. By being alone, gay or straight, I'm defying God's plan... aren't I?

Thank you for the encouragment; since we appear to be in the same boat that can only be a good thing.

My examples were to show you a liek situation where I was trying to justify doing an action because of my desires, but I agree that the non-Christian man would be a problem in more ways than one.

If it fulfills all other definitions of marriage besides sex, then yes, it would similar to a marriage between a man and woman who simply cannot consummate marriage. IN other words, there is a difference between good friends and lovers who are all but sexual (and who would be if only they could justify it! and I htink this is the crux of the matter)

To me, your examples are a little bit like rationalizing. YOu are wanting to find that little bit of definition that does not seem to violate God's definition of righteous. You want your cake and eat it too. You are wanting anything to justify that sort of relationship that is intimate in ways that are not right.

Let's face it, there's a huge difference between freinds and marriage. And if all you wanted was friendship we really would n't be having this discussion.

The scale of love and intimacy between two Church friends is totally different to the scale of love and intimacy between a married couple. Check out Genesis:

"It is not good that man should be alone"

Taken from http://www.reapteam.org/were-adam-and-eve-married:

"None of us were meant to fight through life on our own. And, God's plan isn't that we just have nice, close friends to help us along, although this is part of His plan. But there's more — He wants us to experience total unity with someone."

It is God's plan to have a soul mate to bear the burden of life and to encounter and overcome problems with. It is God's plan to be totally open and intimate with someone else, to feel like we trust them completely. By being alone, gay or straight, I'm defying God's plan... aren't I?

Again, you are wanting to define the righness of what you are doing because you wouldn't be having sex? But marriage, whether or not we actually see somehting going on in the bedroom, is defined as the "oneness" between a man and woman.

I don't understand where you would find scripture to back this idea up. You want some sort of non-sexual union/marriage?

Hmmm, I would want to see examples of this sort of thing in heterosexual couples. A union as strong as marriage, content in their relationship and yet non-sexual and celibate......hmph...not gonna happen. Or, it's not as close to marrage as you want to think.


Why in the world would you want to put yoursel in that position of temptation!?!?

I am homosexual.

When you say 'GLBT friendly churches' what exactly do you mean?

Harry,

I think you know the answers, which are hard given your situation.

As one Christian to another I just say no matter what happens throughout your life, what you feel or do, always keep Christ as the centre of importance. In doing so I am sure at the end of your life you will end up happier, have a richness of character, and most important end up free and justified before God.

Hi Harry,

I do not know how to answer you. Since you are in the UK, I do not know if there are ministries nearby you that can help. If there are any, please look them up.

Being involved in ministry work, all I can do is at best give you second hand advise that I have heard from others who do Christian counseling. What I have heard may not even apply to you but here goes:

--Problem — Love is not sex and sex is not love. It does matter if heterosexual or homosexual — sex alone will not fill any need in ones life for companionship. Lust only supports selfishness.

--Past History — Primary Caregivers, family, parents play a significant role in people's lives. If trust has been violated in any manner — a homosexual draw may occur. A parent could ignore a child, or have over expectations and this could be a factor. Abuse of all types and varieties also are common factors. A perceived hurt can also be a factor. Any of these things must be looked into and realized. This helps overcome issues by facing the issues.

--Through Christ, you can overcome adversity…

--The need for companionship can also be selfish and an excuse to justify the, “I need I want…” for any relationship.

The above statements are the things I have heard from others regarding this matter. Only you know what applies to you and what does not apply. All I can suggest is to find a ministry near you that can help and support you as well as trained experienced Christian counseling in this field. Find out what is in you that is causing these feelings and go from there.

The only thing anyone across the pond can do is to pray for you to stay strong in the Lord and the Power of His Might!

God's Blessings to You!
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Okay, I've found out what kind of love I want from a man. Check this out:



An ideal marriage between a man and women involves Intimacy, Passion and Commitment (Consummate Love). So when you take away sex, something much stronger than mere friendship remains; Intimacy + Commitment (Companionate Love). Some would argue that it would be unwise to put myself in a situation riddled with temptation. I'll just have to work it out; with another Christian celibate gay to relate to and to help me to glorify God (and me help him in turn).

This is none of my business, but perhaps you might want to look for a woman with more dominant features (like a man). I find many men and women that are married into this role (where the woman is dominant). In many cases it works out perfectly fine. I just wanted to put my thoughts out on this. Women are very powerful creations of God and are just as capable as men in various roles, including the intellectual ones.... If it were me, I wish this planet only had more women, I'd be lost and spiritually or physically deprived without them... They rule.

Just a thought..

Hark! Is that a "I am woman, hear me roar" ?

That 's a very nice thing to hear

zoegirl wrote:Hark! Is that a "I am woman, hear me roar" ?

Close but I think it's the other way around...

pesky pronouns....






my defense....it's after midnight here...yep. that's my story and I'm sticking to it

Gman wrote:This is none of my business, but perhaps you might want to look for a woman with more dominant features (like a man). I find many men and women that are married into this role (where the woman is dominant).

http://www.gotquestions.org/roles-husba ... amily.html

Plus, homosexuality isn't a spiritual case of masculine vs. feminine; it's a scientific case of my cells reacting to male phermones, as opposed to female phermones.

Where's the reference for that, please, I've never seen the research for that.