HELLO

[Silvertusk]

Hi nobible.

Just a little point of your definition here about a Christian. (just me being a little pedantic here.. ) A Christian is not someone who just follows the teaching of Christ but first and foremost a Christian is someone who believes Jesus is their saviour by being God and coming down onto earth and dying on a cross as an atonment for their sins - and then ressurecting three days later as validification of his divine authority. That person is a Christian. Following the moral teachings of Christ is the natural progression of that belief.

I consider myself a Christian because I believe in above. I do not consider my self a particularly good Christian because sometimes I stumble (which shames me every time) - but I am a Christian nethertheless and am saved!

There are lot better Good people out there than me - but if they do not believe in above they are not Christians and therefore not saved by definition of Christianity doctrine.

Just out of curiosity if you don't believe in the bible - why should you want to follow Jesus's moral guide anyway?

I am very happy that you are trying to live a good life by following the teachings of Jesus and I pray that you may take another step and believe in who Jesus actually is.

May God bless you on your journey

Silvertusk.

[Silvertusk]

1) There is a core creed that is orthadox and that is the Nicene creed. That is pretty much the definition - if you believe that then you are a Christian. I am not being disrepectful - that is simply the case.

2) Why are you on this site - what is your aim here exactly?

Silvertusk.

[zoegirl]

We follow orthodox Christianity based on the bible, which you have admitted to rejecting (except for those parts YOU happen to agree with) .

So it seems that you are guilty of the same intolerance.

[Silvertusk]

We follow orthodox Christianity based on the bible, which you have admitted to rejecting (except for those parts YOU happen to agree with) .

So it seems that you are guilty of the same intolerance.

So because I'm a Christian who doesn't agree with you theologically, I'm intolerant?
That makes no sense. Your argument would suggest that 2/3 of the world is intolerant, since most of the world is not Christian. lol.

The difference is I never told you to shut up about your views or that you're wrong or going to hell. You've told me more than once that I was wrong, when you could've phrased it much better by saying "I believe that what you say is wrong."

So no, I'm not guilty of intolerance. I support free speech, diversity, and toleration.

What you believe is plainly not Christianity. You have already admitted that you do not believe in the Bible. That is fine - no problem with that - just don't pretend it is Christianity. Christianity has an orthodox creed that spells it out very nicely. If you don't agree with that - then it is not Christianity - it is something else. It is like me saying that I am an athiest but I believe in the Ancient Greek Gods. It does not make sense. Ask youself this - in your "religion" how do you get to Heaven? Do you even beleive in a Heaven? How do you attone for your sins?

[B. W.]

Word from a Moderator:

As I peruse different Christian forums on the web, I have noticed a common feeling amongst readers that would read something like this: “Wish there was a place where Christians can have an intelligent dialogue without being interrupted by individuals with an 'axe to grind.'

At our forum, we make sure we can provide a safe environment for an intelligent dialogue between members and have guidelines to insure this. When one enters this forum to post, individuals agree to follow these guidelines. Moderators enforce these guidelines and we will ban people who have an 'axe to grind' or out 'trolling' or seeking 'converts to their cause.'

This way, we can provide a safe environment for an intelligent dialogue between members. We are a Christian Web site and adhere to the basic doctrines of orthodox Christian faith. We can defend these and will continue to do so. When individuals come into this forum with malice intent — these will be banned. We are open to discuss things in a civil manner. As Moderators, we do give ample warnings to those violating the Forum Guidelines to repent and stop what they are saying. If they refuse — we take this scriptural position:

Proverbs 22:10, “Drive out a scoffer, and strife will go out, and quarreling and abuse will cease. “ ESV

There are some individuals who frequent this Forum, as they do others, and reenter after being banned under another name and continue the same derogatory dribble. Please report such abuse to the moderators.

Thank You! God's blessing to you all!
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[Daniel]

As many people probably gravitate toward science like GodAndScience.org because they are experiencing doubts with their faith, I think that it should be our goal to provide an environment where people who are doubting or who are considering Christianity can feel safe.

[Marcella]

I have only been reading a few messages here and I would like someone (if willing) to help me understand. I have always tried to do the right, morally, noble, and honest things in my life. I tired to raise my children in a Baptist church, why Baptist you might ask. I really don't know, other then when I married my husband, he was Baptist. I come from a Military family and I've experenced alot in my life, from rape to blackmailed into being raped, susicide, trying to find my purpose in this life. Failing (what at one time I called MY GOD) to this person who is just a body waiting to die. My children and husband all believe in GOD, but I can't tell them, that this woman, their mother, their grandmother, the wife, the child that I no longer believe and feel I will have to take this lie that I have been living to my grave. I have already estabilished my own family cemetery and I'm working on my funeral. I lost my older brother (who never did any wrong and was a good and rightous person) to susicide, and my younger and last bother to an accidently overdose. And my father ( before his death) became a preacher. Still with all this in my life. I'm trying to see the beauty in a bug running on the ground. I used to sing, laugh, smile all the time, to now hating myself for not believing anymore. Why does there have to be a symbol, icon or anything called GOD to get someone to do the right thing, or use this same symbol, icon or anything called GOD to hurt or kill people or beautiful things? As you can tell, I put the word GOD in caps, this is out of respect, something I did long ago when I was a believer in the name. So if I'm going to be judged for being here and opening my life book, please tell me and I will leave. Because I've tried to tell the preachers ( that have come and gone from my Church) and they have all failed me, by not talking to me anymore. so I don't go to church anymore. I go to the woods or lock myself away with my crafts and go to work, but something is pulling me to do this and reach out to someone out there. Marcella

[zoegirl]

I an sure anybody here will be glad to answer questions and pray for you.

I know it may seem like a pitiful answer at first, but I would suggest simply reading through the New Testament, especially the Gospels. To see the Love of Jesus and He interacted with those around HIm, people who were hurting, is a tremendous balm to any heart.

I will pray for you...are there any questions specifically?

[Marcella]

Thank you zoegirl for taking the time to send me a reply. After I clicked the send button the guilt started from even talking about my feelings. I'm not sure I can go any futher. i'm so lost and confused in this part of my life. Thank you again for your prescious time.

[zoegirl]

Don't let your guilt stop you from thinking about GOd.

In fact that is one of the most incredible things about the grace offered by Jesus. His death and resurrection removes the guilt and power of sin in our lives. That is HIs LOVE for us. And if you let your guilt block you from even addressing this, you will not establish or grow in your relationship.

That's what grace is....and the stunning gift of grace is seen the nest when we realize our guilt from sin.

Read over the Gospels and see the love of Jesus as He went to the cross for us.

This is one of my favorite devotions from CHarles Spurgeon

Morning, June 28
Go To Evening Reading

“Looking unto Jesus.”

Hebrews 12:2
It is ever the Holy Spirit's work to turn our eyes away from self to Jesus; but Satan's work is just the opposite of this, for he is constantly trying to make us regard ourselves instead of Christ. He insinuates, “Your sins are too great for pardon; you have no faith; you do not repent enough; you will never be able to continue to the end; you have not the joy of his children; you have such a wavering hold of Jesus.” All these are thoughts about self, and we shall never find comfort or assurance by looking within. But the Holy Spirit turns our eyes entirely away from self: he tells us that we are nothing, but that “Christ is all in all.” Remember, therefore, it is not thy hold of Christ that saves thee—it is Christ; it is not thy joy in Christ that saves thee—it is Christ; it is not even faith in Christ, though that be the instrument—it is Christ's blood and merits; therefore, look not so much to thy hand with which thou art grasping Christ, as to Christ; look not to thy hope, but to Jesus, the source of thy hope; look not to thy faith, but to Jesus, the author and finisher of thy faith. We shall never find happiness by looking at our prayers, our doings, or our feelings; it is what Jesus is, not what we are, that gives rest to the soul. If we would at once overcome Satan and have peace with God, it must be by “looking unto Jesus.” Keep thine eye simply on him; let his death, his sufferings, his merits, his glories, his intercession, be fresh upon thy mind; when thou wakest in the morning look to him; when thou liest down at night look to him. Oh! let not thy hopes or fears come between thee and Jesus; follow hard after him, and he will never fail thee.

“My hope is built on nothing less

Than Jesus' blood and righteousness:

I dare not trust the sweetest frame,

But wholly lean on Jesus' name.”

http://www.ccel.org/ccel/spurgeon/morneve.d0628am.html

I'm still praying. Dont leave

[B. W.]

Hi Marcella,

Sometimes the world is so fill of cr*p and terrible things that we come to end our ropes. Things happen that we do not understand. Jesus spoke that the devil comes to kill, rob, and destroy. From this we often ponder, why did God allow all this? I can give you a pat answer but what would that do? However, note this: Jesus defeated the doom and gloom that the evil one throws our way.

Kris Kristofferson sang this old song that coveys a powerful message. I used to sing this when I ran a Prison Ministry. Please read the lyrics:

Why Me Lord
by Kris Kristofferson

Why Me Lord? — What have I ever done to deserve even one of the pleasures I've known?

Tell Me Lord — What did I ever do that that was worth loving you or the kindness you've shown...

(Chorus)

Try Me Lord? — If you think there is a way I can try to repay all I've taken from you

Maybe Lord — I can show someone else what I've been through myself on my way back to you

Chorus:

Lord help me Jesus, I've wasted it

so help me Jesus I know what I am,

But now that I know that I've needed you so

Help me Jesus my soul's in your hands

When you read this line: “Maybe Lord — I can show someone else what I've been through myself on my way back to you…” and then the chorus, I pray you'll understand what I am saying.

Corre ten Boom was a woman who was brought to despair during the 1940's. She watched her sister and had her family perish in the Nazi death camps. She suffered torture in the death camps. She despaired of life. After the World War II she became renowned for preaching on the love of God. Her famous quote was this: “Child, There is No Pit as deep that God's love is yet deeper still.”

Whatever reason for all the terrible things that happen to all of us - “Child, There is No Pit as deep that God's love is yet deeper still.”

“Maybe Lord — I can show someone else what I've been through myself on my way back to you…Lord help me Jesus, I've wasted it so help me Jesus I know what I am, But now that I know that I've needed you…so Help me Jesus my soul's in your hands”

2 Corinthians1:2-4, “Grace to you and peace from God our Father and the Lord Jesus Christ. 3 Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, the Father of mercies and God of all comfort, 4 who comforts us in all our affliction, so that we may be able to comfort those who are in any affliction, with the comfort with which we ourselves are comforted by God.” ESV

You have a purpose and a destiny that only you can fulfill in this mortal life towards others who you have not yet met as well as towards some whom you now know because: The God of all comfort, who comforts us in all our affliction, so that we may be able to comfort those who are in any affliction, with the comfort with which we ourselves are comforted by God..”

I did this once. I went to a quiet place in the hills and yelled and screamed at God for all that happened to me. I never realized how angry I was at God. Then I wept. I wept for hours and left that place with the matter settled and my purpose cemented and found rest for my soul.

The Lord knows our frame that we are dust. He knows everything. Pour out your heart and feeling to him because as Jesus said in Matthew 11:28-30 for us to: “Come to me, all who labor and are heavy laden, and I will give you rest. 29 Take my yoke upon you, and learn from me, for I am gentle and lowly in heart, and you will find rest for your souls. 30 For my yoke is easy, and my burden is light." ESV

I beg you not to take harsh matters into your hands. The Lord wants me to tell you directly this:

“Weep my child,,, Weep …You have a purpose and a destiny that only you can fulfill in this mortal life towards others who you have not yet met as well as towards some whom you now know — for now weep and find your rest. Child, There is No Pit as deep that My love is yet deeper still. For now weep and find rest for your soul...”

Now let me pray for you:

Dear Lord Jesus — hear her despair and see all the rotten things that have happened to her. I beg thee to hold her in your arms tonight - today - now - and pour out your love into her soul. Let her find that rest and weep, and you with her, so she will draw new courage and strength that comes from you. Change her path with a new unshakable hope in you. Let her draw new courage from the wells of your love so that she can fulfill what purposes you have for her to complete. She is not a loser nor at fault for things you've revealed to me that happened in her past that she has not disclosed and that she knows of. Chase away those terrible doubts and fears from the past and recent present. Lead her to a soul that has a good ear to hear and keep the phony's away (she's had enough of them and their abuses). Lord Jesus Christ -- Restrain the forces of evil and darkness that shroud her heart and mind as only you can. Give your word to this and chase these forces away from her according to your great name — Jesus Christ.

Amen-
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[Marcella]

Hi,
as I sit here reading your words, I'm crying, but it is a good cry. You have touched my heart with what you have chose to say to me. and I know you are probably reading this and saying, (it is not me nor my words, but GODs) but it is your voice that chose to make a decision to help me. and the most easiest and simplest words, thank you, aren't enough. Please know that in my heart and mind right now, I feel like singing, I know I still have a long long path to travel and I may not reach the end in this lifetime, but I truely feel, that I'm not alone. I am a spirtual person, but not religous. ( I don't believe in mans GOD) I do feel that something is all around. I'm I crazy? My thoughts can get so deep sometimes and yet I see beauty in simply things, like a dead tree, it still has a purpose ,to give a home to creatures from their enemys. And yes there is more in my life that I have not shared, I seem to only remember the bad things, I can't remember much of my childhood or good things. I constantly have nightmares to the point that I'm afraid to sleep unless I take something. I do remember, when I was a young girl (maybe 6 or 7), I was riding my tryclcle and I was sucking on a butterscoth candy, I was along and I got choked and fell of my bike. As I lay looking into the the blue sky with beautful white clouds, I wasn't afraid, and then an old woman stood over me and said I would be ok. The woman disappeared and the candy came unlogged and I got up and went home, I never told my parents what happpen. I have never been afraid of dieing. I never understood about bad things in this world and when things bad happened to me, I didn't know what I did wrong to cause it.
I'm sorry, I seem to be rambling. Thank you again.

[B. W.]

Hi,
as I sit here reading your words, I'm crying, but it is a good cry. You have touched my heart with what you have chose to say to me. and I know you are probably reading this and saying, (it is not me nor my words, but GODs) but it is your voice that chose to make a decision to help me. and the most easiest and simplest words, thank you, aren't enough. Please know that in my heart and mind right now, I feel like singing, I know I still have a long long path to travel and I may not reach the end in this lifetime, but I truely feel, that I'm not alone. I am a spirtual person, but not religous. ( I don't believe in mans GOD) I do feel that something is all around. I'm I crazy? My thoughts can get so deep sometimes and yet I see beauty in simply things, like a dead tree, it still has a purpose ,to give a home to creatures from their enemys. And yes there is more in my life that I have not shared, I seem to only remember the bad things, I can't remember much of my childhood or good things. I constantly have nightmares to the point that I'm afraid to sleep unless I take something. I do remember, when I was a young girl (maybe 6 or 7), I was riding my tryclcle and I was sucking on a butterscoth candy, I was along and I got choked and fell of my bike. As I lay looking into the the blue sky with beautful white clouds, I wasn't afraid, and then an old woman stood over me and said I would be ok. The woman disappeared and the candy came unlogged and I got up and went home, I never told my parents what happpen. I have never been afraid of dieing. I never understood about bad things in this world and when things bad happened to me, I didn't know what I did wrong to cause it.
I'm sorry, I seem to be rambling. Thank you again.

Keep on the long long path of life and you will find your prupose. Also, feel free to ramble!

Sounds like you may have had a encounter with an angel so that should be a personal sign that there is hope and love in this world. Let it begin in you. If it is okay with you, I will send you a privet email we use on this forum for members. Let me know if that would be okay.

God's blessings be upon you! -
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[Marcella]

you know it is strange. I had not heard from anyone since my last post, so as usual, I thought I had offended someone and it would be best for me to leave. I was trying earlier this evening to delet my profile and name off this site. I couldn't figure out how to do it. so I gave up...Then out of the blue comes your message, a message that maybe for real I have found someone that will listen to me and maybe help me understand the strange things happening to me now and things from the past.. yes you may email me priviatley. I must warn you. I can ask some very in depte question and get into some long and tuff debates. Since my last so called open book life confession, much has happen in my life. My daughter is hanging on the faith that GOD will not fail her and her family in this time of hardship. I don't have much money. It all gos out on bills, grandkids school supplies, gas, that my daughter(who hardly talks to me or even ask me for something) asked me on a doctors trip with her and my granddaughter. While on this trip, I just listen to her talk, her problems, etc. mostly bills, billls, and more bills. But one thing stood out, I asked about her trailor payments, and she said they were going to forclose on it for less then 2,000.00 dollars. I was going to retire, but I will work longer to make sure that bill was paid and paid now. My daughter never asked me for money. I have always been the one to offer the help. I went to my mom and worked out a plan to pay here trailor off this week. And it will be done by friday. She is a great young lady and she has always paid back anything my husband or I have gave her..The moral of this story is GOD is takin care of her and her family with 2 angles, my mother and myself..Angles are all around us...funny some times they are our on selves.

[B. W.]

you know it is strange. I had not heard from anyone since my last post, so as usual, I thought I had offended someone and it would be best for me to leave. I was trying earlier this evening to delet my profile and name off this site. I couldn't figure out how to do it. so I gave up...Then out of the blue comes your message, a message that maybe for real I have found someone that will listen to me and maybe help me understand the strange things happening to me now and things from the past.. yes you may email me priviatley. I must warn you. I can ask some very in depte question and get into some long and tuff debates. Since my last so called open book life confession, much has happen in my life. My daughter is hanging on the faith that GOD will not fail her and her family in this time of hardship. I don't have much money. It all gos out on bills, grandkids school supplies, gas, that my daughter(who hardly talks to me or even ask me for something) asked me on a doctors trip with her and my granddaughter. While on this trip, I just listen to her talk, her problems, etc. mostly bills, billls, and more bills. But one thing stood out, I asked about her trailor payments, and she said they were going to forclose on it for less then 2,000.00 dollars. I was going to retire, but I will work longer to make sure that bill was paid and paid now. My daughter never asked me for money. I have always been the one to offer the help. I went to my mom and worked out a plan to pay here trailor off this week. And it will be done by friday. She is a great young lady and she has always paid back anything my husband or I have gave her..The moral of this story is GOD is takin care of her and her family with 2 angles, my mother and myself..Angles are all around us...funny some times they are our on selves.

Yes bills and more bills sound too familiar. I think it is a rare person who has enough money these days and times.

Sometimes it am take me a day or so to reply but I will. Also, I would like to ask Zoegirl if she would like to join in too as she has great insights!

I'll send you a Privet email a little later as I am on my lunch break from work and need to head back in soon.
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