Evidence for God from Science

Hey guys, well from the title its obvious what i am trying to achieve...now last night i was having a discussion about why Jesus is God and other thinsg of the sort to a muslim - every question he asked i answered back and provided clear scripture, so i think i did pretty well haha the fact that i havent seen him around shows it. But now another one came and im having a bit of trouble - here are the links he provided me to show how the bible is corrupt ( obvious islamic follower)

http://www.answering-christianity.com/1 ... ctions.htm

http://www.answering-christianity.com/d ... canons.htm

Would you guys have anything to rebuke this?

God bless you guys

That is so hilarious, since the site I was at today has the counter publication to that first link. Great work, btw.

Here's what you need: 101 Cleared Up Contradictions in the Bible

BTW, did you see what I posted earlier? It's the best short article on the "errors" of the bible I have read. http://discussions.godandscience.org/vi ... 655#p82655 page 9

The canons thing I don't think is a big deal. The early Christians did NOT think Christ did not rise from the dead; that's a heresy that the apostles and early church dealt with. Anyway, there is a difference between the canon of the Catholic church and that recognized by protestants, but without reading all that stuff, I know they're making more of it (a lot more) than is historical. This is something I worked on a little while ago, that I didn't post or publish anywhere - maybe it would be useful to you. I don't know why my references aren't attached . . .

“How is the Catholic bible different from the Protestant bible?”
Most obviously different from Bible versions that Catholics use compared with Protestant versions is the inclusion of 14 "Apocrypha," intertestamental manuscripts that are considered extra-canonical by Protestants (neither are they included within the Hebrew scriptures).

Biblical Canon: The Old Testament, called the Tanakh by Jews, was accepted by the early church as it existed at the time of Christ. It contains 39 books. The 27 books of the New Testament were used, circulated, and deemed "scripture" (divinely inspired) by the early church. They were affirmed by two different church councils as the Christian biblical canon in the late 300s. (Two councils, Hippo in 393 and Carthage in 397, affirmed the 27 books as Christian biblical canon. Apocryphal writings were not deemed scriptural and were not included in the canon.)

Apocrypha/deuterocanonical works: Apocrypha are the 12 to 15 additional books or works that are found within Roman Catholic bibles. Protestant bibles in times past included these as well, but in a separate section, and they were never considered canon. The Roman Catholic church at the Council of Trent, 1546, made these manuscripts official canon; "deuterocanon" means "second canon." This was a response to the Protestant Reformation.

A list of Apocrypha: 1 Esdras; 2 Esdras; Tobit; Judith; Additions to Esther; Wisdom of Solomon; Ecclesiasticus; Baruch; Epistle of Jeremiah; Song of the Three Children; Story of Susanna; Bel and the Dragon; Prayer of Manasseh; 1 Maccabees; and, 2 Maccabees. This is the list of Protestant Apocrypha; the Roman Catholic list is a bit shorter, while the Orthodox list is a bit longer.

Apocrypha and Pseudepigrapha: Apocrypha are not considered scripture by many because they often contain historical errors or they contradict canon. Some even fall within the category of pseudepigrapha, which are falsely authored. The Wisdom of Solomon is one such book as it was clearly written long after Solomon had died. The Epistle of Jeremiah and the Prayer of Manasseh are other pseudepigraphic documents that are also Apocrypha.

Catholic Bible Versions: Old Testament scripture was all originally in Hebrew, while the New Testament scripture was in Greek. After Latin grew in popularity, the scriptures were translated into that language by Jerome. This bible, called the Vulgate, was used for a very long time. The modern English bible used by Catholics--and the first to be translated from the original Hebrew and Greek (since Jerome)--is the New American Bible (NAB, 1970).

Protestant Bible Versions: There are many Protestant bible translations. They are based on the original languages but they differ based on whether they rely more on a word-for-word translation, or one based on meaning. The NIV, or New International Version (1978), is the most popular. It is easy to read and basically hits a middle ground in the two translation types. The King James Version (KJV. 1611) is still used by many and is more of a word-for-word translation. The New Revised Standard Version (NRSV, 1990) is a modern translation of the KJV. Another highly regarded translation is the New American Standard NAS, 1995).

CeT-To wrote:Hey guys, well from the title its obvious what i am trying to achieve...now last night i was having a discussion about why Jesus is God and other thinsg of the sort to a muslim - every question he asked i answered back and provided clear scripture, so i think i did pretty well haha the fact that i havent seen him around shows it. But now another one came and im having a bit of trouble - here are the links he provided me to show how the bible is corrupt ( obvious islamic follower)

http://www.answering-christianity.com/1 ... ctions.htm

http://www.answering-christianity.com/d ... canons.htm

Would you guys have anything to rebuke this?

God bless you guys

For the second one History of the Bible: How The Bible Came To Us by Wesley Ringer
and
The Historicity of the New Testament JP Moreland

YAYAY thanx guys hehee! I'll keep you updated on any other difficulties i might come across to while defending our faith to the blind

You guys are the best hehe ! God bless

how can god split the seas for moses yet he cant stop a tsunami? LOL my friend asked me this and i dont know why i have a hard time answering this... help please

CeT-To wrote:how can god split the seas for moses yet he cant stop a tsunami?

Who says God wants to stop a tsunami?

FL

Fürstentum Liechtenstein wrote:

CeT-To wrote:how can god split the seas for moses yet he cant stop a tsunami?

Who says God wants to stop a tsunami?

FL

hmm thats what i thought too...might be some sort of judgement..but i dont think there is a definite answer not sure though...

Evil and Suffering
This is just a list of articles from the main site which may address your concern. I will look into this more when I have time, but for now I can link you to these.
God Bless!

CeT-To wrote:

Fürstentum Liechtenstein wrote:

CeT-To wrote:how can god split the seas for moses yet he cant stop a tsunami?

Who says God wants to stop a tsunami?

FL

hmm thats what i thought too...might be some sort of judgement..but i dont think there is a definite answer not sure though...

The real question behind that person's question is, not about how God can't do it - stop the tsunami - but why He won't. It's pretty obvious that God doesn't stop a lot of natural disasters. So, obviously, He chose to create a world that runs on its own without Him intervening all of the time. There could be some debate about whether the world is "cursed" now and does more damage to people than it would have if Adam didn't rebel, but that's for another post or time.

CeT-To wrote:how can god split the seas for moses yet he cant stop a tsunami? LOL my friend asked me this and i dont know why i have a hard time answering this... help please

I hear some of my christian brothers and sisters say it is the prince of this world (satin) behind some of the things that happen. i.e. tsunami's.

I don't know the extent of satin's power, but when I read the book of Job it is clear GOD gave certain power to satin to discourage Job. See Job 1 : 12-19 . Pay close attention to verses 12,16 and 19. It seems satin was granted control of fire and wind to test Job. I'm not sure if this control was a one time deal or ongoing.

Job 1: 12 - 19

12 And the Lord said to Satan, “Behold, all that he has is in your hand. Only against him do not stretch out your hand.” So Satan went out from the presence of the Lord. 13 Now there was a day when his sons and daughters were eating and drinking wine in their oldest brother's house, 14 and there came a messenger to Job and said, “The oxen were plowing and the donkeys feeding beside them, 15 and wthe Sabeans fell upon them and took them and struck down the servants3 with the edge of the sword, and I alone have escaped to tell you.” 16 While he was yet speaking, there came another and said, x“The fire of God fell from heaven and burned up the sheep and the servants and consumed them, and I alone have escaped to tell you.” 17 While he was yet speaking, there came another and said, y“The Chaldeans formed zthree groups and made a raid on the camels and took them and struck down the servants with the edge of the sword, and I alone have escaped to tell you.” 18 While he was yet speaking, there came another and said, a“Your sons and daughters were eating and drinking wine in their oldest brother's house, 19 and behold, a great wind came across bthe wilderness and struck the four corners of the house, and it fell upon the young people, and they are dead, and I alone have escaped to tell you.”

Just a thought

Good luck with your friend CeT-To.

sinnerbybirth wrote:

CeT-To wrote:how can god split the seas for moses yet he cant stop a tsunami? LOL my friend asked me this and i dont know why i have a hard time answering this... help please

I hear some of my christian brothers and sisters say it is the prince of this world (satin) behind some of the things that happen. i.e. tsunami's.

I don't know the extent of satin's power, but when I read the book of Job it is clear GOD gave certain power to satin to discourage Job. See Job 1 : 12-19 . Pay close attention to verses 12,16 and 19. It seems satin was granted control of fire and wind to test Job. I'm not sure if this control was a one time deal or ongoing.

Job 1: 12 - 19

12 And the Lord said to Satan, “Behold, all that he has is in your hand. Only against him do not stretch out your hand.” So Satan went out from the presence of the Lord. 13 Now there was a day when his sons and daughters were eating and drinking wine in their oldest brother's house, 14 and there came a messenger to Job and said, “The oxen were plowing and the donkeys feeding beside them, 15 and wthe Sabeans fell upon them and took them and struck down the servants3 with the edge of the sword, and I alone have escaped to tell you.” 16 While he was yet speaking, there came another and said, x“The fire of God fell from heaven and burned up the sheep and the servants and consumed them, and I alone have escaped to tell you.” 17 While he was yet speaking, there came another and said, y“The Chaldeans formed zthree groups and made a raid on the camels and took them and struck down the servants with the edge of the sword, and I alone have escaped to tell you.” 18 While he was yet speaking, there came another and said, a“Your sons and daughters were eating and drinking wine in their oldest brother's house, 19 and behold, a great wind came across bthe wilderness and struck the four corners of the house, and it fell upon the young people, and they are dead, and I alone have escaped to tell you.”

Just a thought

Good luck with your friend CeT-To.

Yes but unlike Job, people have died hmmm is there any record of the places where they were hit caused any major sin that alarmed God liike sodom & gomora ?

Are you asking if God is judging areas and nations today, with natural disasters? We know of God's judgment of Sodom and Gomorrah because of what the bible says, and those places became uninhabitable. I'd have to look into this more, but in the church era God's wrath and judgment are reserved for the end times, I believe.

cslewislover wrote:Are you asking if God is judging areas and nations today, with natural disasters? We know of God's judgment of Sodom and Gomorrah because of what the bible says, and those places became uninhabitable. I'd have to look into this more, but in the church era God's wrath and judgment are reserved for the end times, I believe.

Yeah i guess you are right, thanx for the help you guys are giving me ^_^ i guess the question now is " if it wasn't judgement then why didnt He stop it?"

CeT-To said:

Yes but unlike Job, people have died hmmm is there any record of the places where they were hit caused any major sin that alarmed God liike sodom & gomora

Hey CeT-To,

I'm not sure what you saying? People did die in the story of Job. I believe at the hand of satin. As far as sodom and gamora goes, there wasn't even 10 rightous people to be found.

GOD bless CeT-To

CeT-To wrote:

cslewislover wrote:Are you asking if God is judging areas and nations today, with natural disasters? We know of God's judgment of Sodom and Gomorrah because of what the bible says, and those places became uninhabitable. I'd have to look into this more, but in the church era God's wrath and judgment are reserved for the end times, I believe.

Yeah i guess you are right, thanx for the help you guys are giving me ^_^ i guess the question now is " if it wasn't judgement then why didnt He stop it?"

Here is an article link from the God from Science main page: Haiti Earthquake Kills Over 200,000: Where was God?

Here's a short article about this from gotquestions.org


Question: "Why does God allow natural disasters, i.e. earthquakes, hurricanes, and tsunamis?"

Answer: Why does God allow earthquakes, tornados, hurricanes, tsunamis, typhoons, cyclones, mudslides, and other natural disasters? Tragedies such as the 2004 tsunami in Asia, Hurricane Katrina in 2005, the 2008 cyclone in Myanmar, and the 2010 earthquake in Haiti cause many people to question God's goodness. It is distressing that natural disasters are often termed “acts of God” while no “credit” is given to God for years, decades, or even centuries of peaceful weather. God created the whole universe and the laws of nature (Genesis 1:1). Most natural disasters are a result of these laws at work. Hurricanes, typhoons, and tornados are the results of divergent weather patterns colliding. Earthquakes are the result of the earth's plate structure shifting. A tsunami is caused by an underwater earthquake.

The Bible proclaims that Jesus Christ holds all of nature together (Colossians 1:16-17). Could God prevent natural disasters? Absolutely! Does God sometimes influence the weather? Yes, as we see in Deuteronomy 11:17 and James 5:17. Numbers 16:30-34 shows us that God sometimes causes natural disasters as a judgment against sin. The book of Revelation describes many events which could definitely be described as natural disasters (Revelation chapters 6, 8, and 16). Is every natural disaster a punishment from God? Absolutely not.

In much the same way that God allows evil people to commit evil acts, God allows the earth to reflect the consequences sin has had on creation. Romans 8:19-21 tells us, “The creation waits in eager expectation for the sons of God to be revealed. For the creation was subjected to frustration, not by its own choice, but by the will of the one who subjected it, in hope that the creation itself will be liberated from its bondage to decay and brought into the glorious freedom of the children of God.” The fall of humanity into sin had effects on everything, including the world we inhabit. Everything in creation is subject to “frustration” and “decay.” Sin is the ultimate cause of natural disasters just as it is the cause of death, disease, and suffering.

We can understand why natural disasters occur. What we do not understand is why God allows them to occur. Why did God allow the tsunami to kill over 225,000 people in Asia? Why did God allow Hurricane Katrina to destroy the homes of thousands of people? For one thing, such events shake our confidence in this life and force us to think about eternity. Churches are usually filled after disasters as people realize how tenuous their lives really are and how life can be taken away in an instant. What we do know is this: God is good! Many amazing miracles occurred during the course of natural disasters that prevented even greater loss of life. Natural disasters cause millions of people to reevaluate their priorities in life. Hundreds of millions of dollars in aid is sent to help the people who are suffering. Christian ministries have the opportunity to help, minister, counsel, pray, and lead people to saving faith in Christ! God can, and does, bring great good out of terrible tragedies (Romans 8:28).