Evidence for God from Science

A friend of mine posted this online earlier:

http://www.project-reason.org/bibleContra_big.pdf

I glanced over a lot of them, and honestly at the time felt a bit overwhelmed. After all, that's 400+ contradictions. But, after randomly selecting a bunch of them, I found them not to be contradictions at all (some of them didn't even portray what the listed 'contradiction' was). For another, there was a descrepancy in a date by 4 days. I came to find out by doing a small google search that this is because there was a 4 day event that happened and that Jewish history records it that way.

This stuff used to bother me a lot because of how insurmountable it seemed, but the more I look into it, the more I realize that some of the more militant atheists are no less likely to repeat dogmas and false information as religiously illiterate followers of religion. The only difference is that whereas the religious people might claim moral high-ground, the militants claim intellectual high-ground. I've not had very much fun debating the guy who posted it or some of his friends because they talk down to me and other Christians as a default stance. I much prefer debates with people who will talk to you at your level without condescension.

Anyway, not to get off-topic. Just wanted to post it and challenge people to go and explore some of these 'contradictions'. It was actually kind of fun to see the inaccuracies that were made in the creation of that document

I've read many "bible contradictions" very few have enough merit to even begin investigating. The sheer number of "contradictions" posted and the words "project-reason" in that address reveal to me that atheists are not as intellectually open to discovering the world as they like to think, and are rather pushing an anti-religious, arrogant agenda to satisfy the need to be superior to others.

After all, 400+ reasons the bible is wrong sounds a lot better than "Here's 3 specific parts of the bible we feel are contradictory, would anyone mind having a reasonable discussion as to the context, intent and meaning of them, and the possibility that they are not contradictions at all?"

Bottom line is , words used in this overwhelmingly secular movement like "freethinkers" are awfully hypocritical when the attitude towards religion is exposed to be ground in reasons not in the realm of intellectually open discourse.

Right... I think that's an excellent summary. To begin the debate with loaded terms and such 'overwhelming evidence' as these lists is actually something you'd expect from a position of weakness. Of the friends of mine who are atheists, the most vocal and anti-religious will refer to themselves as free thinkers, reasonable, rational, and will make sure that every reference they have towards religion is framed through the lens that religious people are the opposite, and even dangerous. When I've called them out on it, they respond with things like "so, its arrogant to criticize other viewpoints", completely missing the point in a way that leads me to believe there's a level of bias that prevents intelligent discussion.

I guess what's becoming interesting to me is that a lot of these guys spend more time talking about how much they dislike religion than most religious people spend talking about why the like their religion (at least, in the public arena). They also do so in a manner similar to how I behave typically when my faith is wavering, except it is consistently that way with them (loaded terms, etc).

Back on topic... I've actually really enjoyed actual debates with people about apparent contradictions, and oddly enough they've really only been with Christians. But, you generally know a debate has gone well when you can both agree to disagree with no hard feelings and still feel happy with the result, and that's how those that didn't resolve our differences have gone.

MarcusOfLycia wrote:A friend of mine posted this online earlier:

http://www.project-reason.org/bibleContra_big.pdf

I glanced over a lot of them, and honestly at the time felt a bit overwhelmed. After all, that's 400+ contradictions. But, after randomly selecting a bunch of them, I found them not to be contradictions at all (some of them didn't even portray what the listed 'contradiction' was). For another, there was a descrepancy in a date by 4 days. I came to find out by doing a small google search that this is because there was a 4 day event that happened and that Jewish history records it that way.

This stuff used to bother me a lot because of how insurmountable it seemed, but the more I look into it, the more I realize that some of the more militant atheists are no less likely to repeat dogmas and false information as religiously illiterate followers of religion. The only difference is that whereas the religious people might claim moral high-ground, the militants claim intellectual high-ground. I've not had very much fun debating the guy who posted it or some of his friends because they talk down to me and other Christians as a default stance. I much prefer debates with people who will talk to you at your level without condescension.

Anyway, not to get off-topic. Just wanted to post it and challenge people to go and explore some of these 'contradictions'. It was actually kind of fun to see the inaccuracies that were made in the creation of that document

There are lots of answers to so-called Bible contradictions -- on-line and in books.

http://www.debate.org.uk/topics/apolog/contrads.htm

http://www.answering-islam.org/Bible/Contra/index.html

http://www.thedevineevidence.com/skepti ... tions.html

http://www.apologeticspress.org/allegeddiscrepancies/

http://www.tektonics.org/lp/merrit01.html

http://www.muslimhope.com/BibleAnswers.htm

http://www.dtl.org/bible/treatise/contr ... part-1.htm

http://www.bringyou.to/apologetics/bible.htm#INDEX

A Harmony of the Resurrection Accounts

http://answering-islam.org/Andy/Resurre ... rmony.html


Ask your friend to look up the answers himself.

When he posted it online, I actually just ignored it. I figured leaving it there would help expose some of the fraud: someone who claims to be open minded and rational/reasonable about everything posting something laughably ignorant and easily disproved. I wonder if others have ever encountered the situation I'm having with him. It seems the more anti-Christian he becomes, the more about Christianity (what he claimed at one point to embrace) he seems to completely forget about or completely misinterpret.

MarcusOfLycia wrote:When he posted it online, I actually just ignored it. I figured leaving it there would help expose some of the fraud: someone who claims to be open minded and rational/reasonable about everything posting something laughably ignorant and easily disproved. I wonder if others have ever encountered the situation I'm having with him. It seems the more anti-Christian he becomes, the more about Christianity (what he claimed at one point to embrace) he seems to completely forget about or completely misinterpret.

I've never had the problem with Christians. I think some "Christians" whose faith is rather weak might be dismayed by a list of so-called contradictions in the Bible.

When I considered Christianity, I made it my business to look up answers myself. As a result my faith in the Bible became stronger. Apparently your friend has not taken the time to investigate.

I have encountered this type of allegation against Christianity from atheists, some who said they were Christians at one time and left. My experience with them is that they too do not take the time to investigate. I've involved myself in a topic started by an atheist: "Did Jesus really rise from the dead." "Did Jesus claim to be the Messiah?" "Did Jesus claim to be God." My impression is that atheists DO NOT WANT TO BELIEVE and it seems to me from what I have seen, they will make any excuse not to believe. The ignorance of these atheists is just plain overwhelming. One said he wants to help Christians see the light and not make the mistake of being a Christian.

And, of course, I get contradiction lists in spades from Muslims!

I have never found any "contradiction" that cannot be successfully answered.

Your friend is doing something called elephant hurling.
Well, how do you eat an elephant?

.....One bite at a time.

I'd simply ask your friend. "Of these 'apparent' contradictions, which ones reflect your actually personal reasons for your rejection of the bible?" He is either going to have to answer honestly or deceptively. If he says all of them. Just say. "Which of these, if you had to pick one, is most concerning to you?"
What you've done here is two things. You'll see if you have someone open to spiritual things, or an antagonist. And you will open the door for reason and logic. And then you can begin to show your friend that the only basis for looking at things in a reasonable and logical manner is that the presumptive existance of reason and logic.

There is a good chance that your friend has never really studied the issue at all. The most loving thing you can do is reveal the sinking sand of the worldview he is standing on. And the best way to reveal is for them to actually see it for themselves.

One said he wants to help Christians see the light and not make the mistake of being a Christian.

How noble. Of course it totally contradicts his worldview. If one follows atheism to its ultimate end, then one has no grounds to be concerned with anyone being wrong. Since there is no objective standard of right or wrong, there is no standard to hold us to or measure us by.