Evidence for God from Science

I see that the general attitude towards atheists is disdain, and that you think of us as 'arrogant idiots' and/or 'ignorant'.

Ouch! I've got to say ... that as a person who's never believed in a god, or God him/her/itself but HAVE read The 'Good Book' I'm a little more knowledgeable than your average "Der-was-a-big-Bangg-and-den-da-wurld-woz-made-theist" - I'd like a grown up debate about the evidence for and against God/gods.

I'll try and entice you with this little snippet and introduction, and will post tomorrow when I've put a proper reply together.

Jason

I see that the general attitude towards atheists is disdain, and that you think of us as 'arrogant idiots' and/or 'ignorant'.

I think you might have confused disdain with pity or if there is any disdain it is for the tired old arguments that we hear over and over that have been refuted already.

Dan

I'm not a moderator, but I'd just like to point you to the Board Guidelines... remember that this site is more like an online church, open for honest "seekers" (those who have an actual desire to see if Christianity is right for them), not a forum for nasty debates. The reason we often become upset at atheists is, as Danieltwotwenty said, they come to this site over and over hurling the same two-dimensional elephants our way with no desire to actually pursue Christianity... only to contradict it. This behavior frustrates us.

On the other hand, we are always open to anybody who has honest questions for us (not questions they make just to attack us). If you feel that you want to know more about Christianity we would love to have you here! But if your only motive for coming to this site is to argue against us, perhaps you should check out a debate forum elsewhere.

Thanks KMR - took the words right out of my typing hand.

I never gave the impression that I was going to 'attack' anyone, nor do you HAVE to defend your views on this almighty being who lives in the sky. My thread was allowed by a moderator, I thought that when I put my views across that Christians who follow the word of God would be patient, and not judge, it is not for man to judge. (Am I right?)

I've just been told that you 'pity' atheists, like we're some stupid creature because we don't believe - what makes YOU* right and US* and THEM* wrong?

YOU* - Christians
US* - Atheists
THEM* - Other religions

I will repeat what KMR said - please read the Discussion board guildlines and rules and consider whether this is the board for you. Then also read the material we have on the main site - especially the section on answering Athiest questions. If you have any questions on that please feel free to post them here

Poyol » Fri Feb 10, 2012 3:18 pm

I never gave the impression that I was going to 'attack' anyone, nor do you HAVE to defend your views on this almighty being who lives in the sky. My thread was allowed by a moderator, I thought that when I put my views across that Christians who follow the word of God would be patient, and not judge, it is not for man to judge. (Am I right?)

I've just been told that you 'pity' atheists, like we're some stupid creature because we don't believe - what makes YOU* right and US* and THEM* wrong?

YOU* - Christians
US* - Atheists
THEM* - Other religions

Poy, who told you that you can't (or we can't judge), we can't judge a man's sin, but we can judge who is serious who is not. You can judge, if the guy you just met was a thief or was your last GF truly honest with you? So don't try to jump in on everyone with your presumptions, you may be misinformed or wrong.

You are of course free to ask questions, debate, whatever you like. As you said, lets get down to your "I'd like a grown up debate about the evidence for and against God/gods. "

Poyol wrote:I never gave the impression that I was going to 'attack' anyone, nor do you HAVE to defend your views on this almighty being who lives in the sky. My thread was allowed by a moderator, I thought that when I put my views across that Christians who follow the word of God would be patient, and not judge, it is not for man to judge. (Am I right?)

I've just been told that you 'pity' atheists, like we're some stupid creature because we don't believe - what makes YOU* right and US* and THEM* wrong?

YOU* - Christians
US* - Atheists
THEM* - Other religions

Truth always makes someone wrong. Don't take issue with Christians because they believe they're right and you and others wrong, and we won't take issue with you for believing you're right and we're wrong. Take your issue up with epistemology which is concerned with who is right and who is wrong. That said, being a Christian board we will take exception with your beliefs (non-Christians) which is the way any healthy debate should be. Play ball, not the person.

Don't get me wrong. We have had other Atheists in the past on this board, some older but sadly no longer visit, or occasionally do. They have held healthy discussions with Christians here without trying to make us out to be ignorant bigoted fools at every turn. To those who carry such disdain towards Christians (the majority of those you seem the associate with, and who probably mocked this site or board before you decided to visit), expect the same disdain to be shown back on perhaps more courteously by being politely shown the door to this board.

Poyol why are you going from being so on the offensive to being on the defensive, nobody is "judging you" or "attacking" you, they just pointed out the guidelines.

Immediately calling out our flaws isn't exactly a great way to start a conversation either....

Poy,

What would you like to discuss, are there any particular areas of interest to you. Origins of the universe? Morality?
Or, is there anything that has been said with disdain you'd like to specifiy? (Please be specific.)

Poyol wrote:I see that the general attitude towards atheists is disdain, and that you think of us as 'arrogant idiots' and/or 'ignorant'.

Ouch! I've got to say ... that as a person who's never believed in a god, or God him/her/itself but HAVE read The 'Good Book' I'm a little more knowledgeable than your average "Der-was-a-big-Bangg-and-den-da-wurld-woz-made-theist" - I'd like a grown up debate about the evidence for and against God/gods.

I'll try and entice you with this little snippet and introduction, and will post tomorrow when I've put a proper reply together.

Jason

HOW willing are you to investigate the evidences for a personal theistic Creator , and, HOW committed are you to needing atheism to be true , both for your personal life as well as a worldview ? What kind of evidence(s) would be compelling enough for you to willfully surrender your entire life as a resonable response of love to the Creator of everything which would include your non-material Soul and thereby being YOUR very own Creator ?

Poyol wrote:I've just been told that you 'pity' atheists, like we're some stupid creature because we don't believe - what makes YOU* right and US* and THEM* wrong?

YOU* - Christians
US* - Atheists
THEM* - Other religions

No, not 'like' anything of the sort. I don't pity people who can't afford to feed their families because I think they are stupid. I pity them because I can afford to do that and I'm saddened that they can't. It doesn't involve thinking less of them; it involves thinking more of them than myself, especially if I go to offer to help them.

In response to your second point, which is entirely different than your first (in the future, try not to merge completely different things together as it is harder to respond):

I believe the evidence, coupled with a willingness to believe that the natural universe is only part of what exists, would in time lead someone to the conclusion that Christianity makes the most sense out of any worldview. Now, you can disagree with me if you'd like, and that is absolutely permitted in this world. But only one of us can be right. If you consider every worldview that exists, there are contradictions between how all of them deal with epistimology, ethics, and metaphysics. Only one view can be right (or none), so believing that oneself possesses the truth is just a normal outcome of logic.

These conversations never go anywhere do they?

Murray wrote:These conversations never go anywhere do they?

Not when they are confronted with logic and reason.

Dan

Danieltwotwenty wrote:

Murray wrote:These conversations never go anywhere do they?

Not when they are confronted with logic and reason.

Dan