Evidence for God from Science

Just thought I'd bring up a point of contention I have with several highly conservative Christians on campus. It has to do with the Bible quote Exodus 20:7

Thou shalt not take the name of the LORD thy God in vain; for the LORD will not hold him guiltless that taketh his name in vain.

Basically, someone near their little demonstration ran into something or stubbed his toe and exclaimed "Jesus!" The Christian group was appalled and asked him to repent his sin, for he had "used the Lord's name in vain," at least according to them.

My stance is that I disagree with the idea that this line means "don't say God or Jesus under any circumstance outside of prayer." I think it's absolutely silly to censor your use of the word "God" or anything, and I certainly don't think the Bible intends this to mean saying Jesus's name out loud is a sin. Rather, I am under the impression that what is being referenced here is the profane use of God's name in a less direct sense. That is, I think it is forbidding the use of God's name or message to make immoral personal gains or to harm others.

For example, using the lord's name as a televangelist who makes millions of dollars off of suckering people into giving you their hard-earned money.
Any number of other scams involving God's name, including those people who claim to be able to make you rich off of their "Godly" investment, or paying for miracle healing.
Utilizing God to gain power/control. I see this in particular being what the Bible warns against. Those who use Christianity to gain power are dangerous people indeed. Throughout history religion (and in particular Christianity) has been used to control the masses and gain political control and influence. Even today, politicians who flaunt their "Christian" life are violating this passage, because they are explicitly using God's name to further their own careers and agendas.

I'll stop ranting for now. Any thoughts?

Well I think we all probably know there are differences, and there is no "one rule fits all scenario's". Context is everything.

Ivellious what is your mom's name?

Now whatever it is, how would you feel if all the kids in your neighbourhood, and many of your friends and strangers used her name in an offensive manner, sometimes even decorated with a few expletives for emphasis. Would this go down well with you?

Now extend that to the Lord and creator of the universe and all that's within it, and you're treading on precarious ground wouldn't you say..

While using God's name as if it were a swear word is obviously not good, I don't think that's what the verse is trying to say. Think to a marriage. The wife takes her husband's name, doesn't she? Wouldn't she be taking that name in vain if she had absolutely zero intention fidelity in the marriage? For us today, it's as if God is saying, "Don't call yourselves Christians if you don't mean it."

Benny Hinn would be a classic example I suppose of someone who takes God's name in vain. Uses God's name to his own advantage.

False prophets are others who were to be put to death if they wrongly spoke on behalf of God because they could lead Israel astray.

Any use, ANY use, which is vain would be applied here. Which means using it as an expression of anger instead of worship, or using it to communicate idolatry, as in Benny Hin.

To use God's name as a curse is extremely offensive, as is using it without worship. I would far prefer to hear any other curse word than God's name and it physically makes me cringe to hear someone using it (as you would be if I used your name over and over again to represent vile feelings and anger). It also makes me annoyed when TV shows bleep out all other words buut for some reason allow Jesus or Christ or both. Sad.


Yes I feel strongly about it. He is my Savior, my God, and He deserves worship, not anger.

Any use, ANY use, which is vain would be applied here. Which means using it as an expression of anger instead of worship, or using it to communicate idolatry, as in Benny Hin.

To use God's name as a curse is extremely offensive, as is using it without worship. I would far prefer to hear any other curse word than God's name and it physically makes me cringe to hear someone using it (as you would be if I used your name over and over again to represent vile feelings and anger). It also makes me annoyed when TV shows bleep out all other words buut for some reason allow Jesus or Christ or both. Sad.


Yes I feel strongly about it. He is my Savior, my God, and He deserves worship, not anger.

zoegirl wrote:Any use, ANY use, which is vain would be applied here. Which means using it as an expression of anger instead of worship, or using it to communicate idolatry, as in Benny Hin.

To use God's name as a curse is extremely offensive, as is using it without worship. I would far prefer to hear any other curse word than God's name and it physically makes me cringe to hear someone using it (as you would be if I used your name over and over again to represent vile feelings and anger). It also makes me annoyed when TV shows bleep out all other words buut for some reason allow Jesus or Christ or both. Sad.


Yes I feel strongly about it. He is my Savior, my God, and He deserves worship, not anger.

Agreed

Ivellious wrote:Just thought I'd bring up a point of contention I have with several highly conservative Christians on campus. It has to do with the Bible quote Exodus 20:7

Thou shalt not take the name of the LORD thy God in vain; for the LORD will not hold him guiltless that taketh his name in vain.

Basically, someone near their little demonstration ran into something or stubbed his toe and exclaimed "Jesus!" The Christian group was appalled and asked him to repent his sin, for he had "used the Lord's name in vain," at least according to them.

My stance is that I disagree with the idea that this line means "don't say God or Jesus under any circumstance outside of prayer." I think it's absolutely silly to censor your use of the word "God" or anything, and I certainly don't think the Bible intends this to mean saying Jesus's name out loud is a sin. Rather, I am under the impression that what is being referenced here is the profane use of God's name in a less direct sense. That is, I think it is forbidding the use of God's name or message to make immoral personal gains or to harm others.

For example, using the lord's name as a televangelist who makes millions of dollars off of suckering people into giving you their hard-earned money.
Any number of other scams involving God's name, including those people who claim to be able to make you rich off of their "Godly" investment, or paying for miracle healing.
Utilizing God to gain power/control. I see this in particular being what the Bible warns against. Those who use Christianity to gain power are dangerous people indeed. Throughout history religion (and in particular Christianity) has been used to control the masses and gain political control and influence. Even today, politicians who flaunt their "Christian" life are violating this passage, because they are explicitly using God's name to further their own careers and agendas.

I'll stop ranting for now. Any thoughts?

It is one of the most outward signs of rebellion toward our Creator to use his name in disgust, dissension, and in a meaningless manner . Sadly, many so called 'Christians' think nothing of using outside the confines of a Christian Church building to emphasis a point in conversation. God is not mocked however, and all will be judged who demonstrate this act of rebellion toward God. One day every single knee is going to bow to the name, and glory of God ...that being the Father, Christ, and the Holy Spirit. At that moment, there will be no one who uses his name flippantly or in a vile manner ... only great regret for having been so utterly vile and rebellious to ones very own Creator. It is interesting to note that no other name has ever been so dragged thru the mud...not Mohammed, not Buddha , not Krishna ....but its open season for the person of Christ, the One whom gave his life up for such ignorant Sinners (which was Me at one time) .

Thank you Ivellious, I had a dealing with a local pastor that made me see the real meaning of taking the lords name in vain.
I agree with the others who say it is offensive to hear people disrespect the lord with idle words too.

It occurred to me just this morning, when I was treated underhandedly in a business dealing with a pastor, that his confessing to be a man of the lord and then dealing under handed with the sale of his church was exactly what Taking the lords name in Vain means.. Using the lord to make more money and shorting hard working people out of their pay to line his pocket and get even with someone who left his church.

It is an offense to the LORD as well as me and the others he mistreated. Certainly didn't expect a Pastor to do what he did. If your a christian and especially someone teaching and preaching the word of God, then how could you in good conscience trick and manipulate others out of their earned income?

I think you're on target. Perhaps we can think of it in terms of marriage. We as believers take God's name in a similar way a wife takes her husband's name. So, taking God's name in vain, could mean calling yourself a believer, without acting like one in word and deed.

Kurieuo wrote:Benny Hinn would be a classic example I suppose of someone who takes God's name in vain. Uses God's name to his own advantage.

False prophets are others who were to be put to death if they wrongly spoke on behalf of God because they could lead Israel astray.

I don't think that you, or myself are in the position to make a judgement or decision on whether or not Benny Hinn is a false prophet. To take an example, he is best friends with Reinhard Bonkke and they do ministry together - are you going to call Bonnke a false evangelist?

In terms of taking the Lord's name in vein, I agree with the above that this becomes a contextual issue and a matter of the heart. Personal conviction is everything here as there is no one rule that will fit the bill.

sam1995 wrote:
I don't think that you, or myself are in the position to make a judgement or decision on whether or not Benny Hinn is a false prophet. To take an example, he is best friends with Reinhard Bonkke and they do ministry together - are you going to call Bonnke a false evangelist?

Sam, I'm with Kurieuo on this one. Benny Hinn is a false prophet, and a charlatan. But please don't take my word for it. Just google "Benny Hinn false prophet", and see for yourself.
I'm not familiar with Bonkke, so I can't speak of him.

RickD wrote:

sam1995 wrote:
I don't think that you, or myself are in the position to make a judgement or decision on whether or not Benny Hinn is a false prophet. To take an example, he is best friends with Reinhard Bonkke and they do ministry together - are you going to call Bonnke a false evangelist?

Sam, I'm with Kurieuo on this one. Benny Hinn is a false prophet, and a charlatan. But please don't take my word for it. Just google "Benny Hinn false prophet", and see for yourself.
I'm not familiar with Bonkke, so I can't speak of him.

I understand where you are coming from completely, and at the same time I'm not defending Benny Hinn because there is controversy which surrounds his ministry and there are without doubt some aspects to his ministry which could be deemed as false. It just doesn't sit well with me making a judgement on that though.

However, I'd rather talk about something more important - you should definitely go and check out Reinhard Bonnke, German evangelist who has brought over 70,000,000 people to know Jesus during his ministry. His preaching is both anointed and incredibly gifted and you will be blessed listening to him! Definitely go and check him out

Sam,

I was curious to who Reinhard bonnke is, so I did a brief search. I haven't done any in depth research yet, but I found some troubling signs. He spouts off a lot of word-faith, prosperity gospel, and signs and wonders gospel buzz words. Like I said, I haven't looked too deeply, but he seems like a typical name-it-and-claim-it adherent.

To be fair, I have to dig a little deeper, but as I was involved in a word-faith ministry before, the buzz words stick out like a sore thumb to me.

It'll be interesting to see how you view his ministry after some more research however I cannot argue with the man's life and testimony!