Evidence for God from Science

Hey all,
I only recently registered, after finding the website which accompanies the forum (which I do think is excellent!). I'm a Christian, very much interested in apologetics and presently studying at university in England.

I just had a few questions, which perhaps do not have straight, clear answers, but if anyone had any input as to new ways to think about these questions, I'd be really grateful.

My first question is to do with how much God 'interacts' with this world. It is sadly the case that some Christian people have Christian relatives suffering from horrendous diseases, and they pray for recovery but it doesn't happen. Other times it does seem to happen (not especially in a 'natural' way, but I have certainly heard stories of recoveries that seem to have some sort of divine input). What I don't understand is why sometimes God seems to answer, and other times not? I'm sure on every occasion he is with us, and sad when we are sad, but sometimes healing comes and sometimes it does not. Is there any point in praying for one's future health, or praying for others who are unwell?

My second question is to do with the soul and the brain. I wholeheartedly believe in an immaterial soul, but it is a sad truism that brain damage, and certain diseases, can change 'who we are'. If we have an immaterial soul, why does this happen? Presumably there must be some sort of interaction between the brain and the soul.

My last question is similar to this. It doesn't seem logical to assume that action potentials firing in our cerebral cortex necessarily correlate to an 'experience' (take vision, for example). Presumably there is some interaction with the brain that lets us 'see' what is in front of us. And that's fine, if it is the case. My only confusion is with other animals. If they do not have a soul, or a 'spirit', can they still interpret vision in the same way we do? It would seem that vision, or 'senses' are more materialistic if they can.

Sorry for the pretty starkly different and complicated questions! If anyone has any input I would be very appreciative. Often sharing these sorts of worries can help a lot.

Hey, these are pretty good questions and no need to apologize for them. Always good to ask questions in the right spirit. I'll try to take these in reverse order. Apologize in advance for the long post, "too long didn't read" summary at the bottom.

3. Many Christians believe that animals do have "souls" or "spirits", what exactly is the nature of their spirit is something that depends on what you believe specifically. Also a point below will relate to this question as well.

2. We have always known that there is a correlation between brain function and mind function. For example, people have always known that if you get hit on the head with a rock, you might start acting wacky. Science has helped fill in the blanks on how that exactly happens, but the general idea hasn't changed. The question is whether mind/brain activity is identical, and I don't think that's really a warranted conclusion unless you are committed to materialism. With this in mind, while I think it would be a mistake to discount the immaterial, a Christian shouldn't be afraid of the material aspect of the brain either because that's part of God's system here too. I think this can also help to explain question #3 on animals.

Presumably there must be some sort of interaction between the brain and the soul.

This is actually called the "interaction problem". There are different answers given to this, but I won't attempt them because I actually don't believe Cartesian/substance dualism (that's the mind/soul on one side and the brain/body on the other) despite my above response appearing to defend them. There are actually different kinds of dualism, I am pretty committed to dualism in general but the version that I currently (I always need to do more study) believe best fits the evidence is the Thomistic understanding called hylemorphic dualism. This is where stuff gets complicated, but hylemorphic dualism avoids the problems you brought up while also avoiding the issues brought up by the belief that the mind is merely physical.

Like I said, if you're going to discuss Thomistic dualism its going to start getting pretty complicated, but if you want more information on it and how it answers your questions I can try to answer and/or provide some links.

1. Oh there's always a point to prayer and I believe God actually always does answer. Sometimes the answer isn't always "yes" and sometimes we might not hear His answer. We can't understand God's plan too clearly, there will be times when we probably won't understand "why" God allowed someone to die.

Now this is yet another area where there is differing beliefs among Christians depending upon their theological system or the person. There are some who believe they're less common or a few that they don't happen in the same way they did in the Bible at all. "Cessationism" is the belief that the "miraculous gifts" like speaking in tongues and healing by individuals have ceased. You can be a true Christian and have a variety of beliefs on this. I'll give my personal opinion below here.

I haven't necessarily thought this through as clearly as some issues, but basically I believe that God answers prayers and fits specific needs in a specific time and place. A person in the Western world can have exposure to medicine and doctors and its really wonderful, but since God has provided doctors in that way a person may not NEED an obvious supernatural miracle. Imo That's part of the reason why missionaries in third world countries seem to report many more miracles than any one of us here may have seen (although I believe they do happen). To be honest I believe that "level of faith" has something to do with it as well. Obviously medicine and doctors and treatments are wonderful tools, but I think that even Christians in the western world have come to believe that miracles "just don't happen". So its no coincidence that those who have faith that God still does do miracles are the ones who actually see them happen, and there are actually more examples of miracles among the "faith-filled" then you'd think (and not easily debunked examples either, people regaining sight and all sorts of cool stuff).

I also think that the "asking God for miracles" part of prayer has become severely overplayed. Asking for miracles is only a very small part of what prayer is supposed to be, and yet people take it to be reading your wish list to God. Prayer is conversation... how much of your conversation with a friend or family member is "asking for stuff"? And yet that's all some people do with God sometimes. And I'd say the vast majority of healing and answered prayer that God performs isn't obviously supernatural divine intervention stuff, it can be "little things" like spiritual health or peace or even things that can be "naturally explained".

Sorry for the long post, I'll summarize.

1. Changed western perception of prayer, its often a matter of faith and simply believe that God does do a lot for us in many ways with most things not being obviously miraculous (in the way most people mean miraculous).

2,3. There are different answers to these depending on what version of dualism you hold to, I think that hylemorphic dualism answers these questions very well. If you want more info I can try to explain or send you a link to a few hours worth of reading trying to explain the subject.

My first question is to do with how much God 'interacts' with this world. It is sadly the case that some Christian people have Christian relatives suffering from horrendous diseases, and they pray for recovery but it doesn't happen. Other times it does seem to happen (not especially in a 'natural' way, but I have certainly heard stories of recoveries that seem to have some sort of divine input). What I don't understand is why sometimes God seems to answer, and other times not? I'm sure on every occasion he is with us, and sad when we are sad, but sometimes healing comes and sometimes it does not. Is there any point in praying for one's future health, or praying for others who are unwell?

God answers Us always, it just may not be the way we want Him to:
EX: when you need courage does God give you courage or the opportunity to be brave?

My second question is to do with the soul and the brain. I wholeheartedly believe in an immaterial soul, but it is a sad truism that brain damage, and certain diseases, can change 'who we are'. If we have an immaterial soul, why does this happen? Presumably there must be some sort of interaction between the brain and the soul.

Soul and Spirit are not the same thing and depending at what stage of Judaisim you are reading about, the soul was simply a way of looking at a living creature.
The soul can die for example. Paul used the term soul to distinguish from the things that were spiritual ( soul = flesh and spirit = immaterial higher state of God and Christ).
There are of course different opinions on the soul, its immortality or lack thereof, its role in who and what we are.

My last question is similar to this. It doesn't seem logical to assume that action potentials firing in our cerebral cortex necessarily correlate to an 'experience' (take vision, for example). Presumably there is some interaction with the brain that lets us 'see' what is in front of us. And that's fine, if it is the case. My only confusion is with other animals. If they do not have a soul, or a 'spirit', can they still interpret vision in the same way we do? It would seem that vision, or 'senses' are more materialistic if they can.

All living creatures have a soul, only humans have a spirit.

My first question is to do with how much God 'interacts' with this world. It is sadly the case that some Christian people have Christian relatives suffering from horrendous diseases, and they pray for recovery but it doesn't happen. Other times it does seem to happen (not especially in a 'natural' way, but I have certainly heard stories of recoveries that seem to have some sort of divine input). What I don't understand is why sometimes God seems to answer, and other times not? I'm sure on every occasion he is with us, and sad when we are sad, but sometimes healing comes and sometimes it does not. Is there any point in praying for one's future health, or praying for others who are unwell?

In our limited perspective, it is hard to understand suffering. Ultimately we all die. Some peacefully in their sleep, and some after suffering with various ailments. As far as God answering, the question becomes, can we persuade God? I would say, not in the sense that most of us understand persuade. Does that mean that prayer is futile? No. God isn't sitting in heaven waiting to decide what He will do. Does that mean that prayer is to no avail? Not according to the scripture. It says things such as, the prayer of a righteous man availeth much. And the prayer of faith can heal the sick. Prayer is not arbitrary. Take God's treatment of Ninevah in the book of Jonah. God's intention was to destroy Ninevah. And God's intention was to spare Ninevah. God's decree was set and unchanging. Ninevah, however had a choice. They could continue on their path and be destroyed, or they could believe God, change their ways and be spared.
Based on God's nature, I see prayer as a means by which we are able to know the will of God. (Romans 12:1-2) If we knew God's will, then we could pray it, and everytime our prayer would be answered. In contrast, we can pray contary to the will of God over and over, and it will be futile. In fact, it won't even be prayer. Prayer is about posturing ourselves to hear God. Not necessarily an audible voice. But, it teaches us to discern God's word, and to apply it in our lives. I think it is pretty evident that we are not operating in an economy like we see in the time of the apostles, so to expect such will leave us scratching our heads, and doubting God.

If God's intention is to heal, then God will supply the prayer of faith to a believer, then that prayer will heal the sick. Prayer is a matter of transforming our minds to know the will of God.

jlay wrote:

My first question is to do with how much God 'interacts' with this world. It is sadly the case that some Christian people have Christian relatives suffering from horrendous diseases, and they pray for recovery but it doesn't happen. Other times it does seem to happen (not especially in a 'natural' way, but I have certainly heard stories of recoveries that seem to have some sort of divine input). What I don't understand is why sometimes God seems to answer, and other times not? I'm sure on every occasion he is with us, and sad when we are sad, but sometimes healing comes and sometimes it does not. Is there any point in praying for one's future health, or praying for others who are unwell?

In our limited perspective, it is hard to understand suffering. Ultimately we all die. Some peacefully in their sleep, and some after suffering with various ailments. As far as God answering, the question becomes, can we persuade God? I would say, not in the sense that most of us understand persuade. Does that mean that prayer is futile? No. God isn't sitting in heaven waiting to decide what He will do. Does that mean that prayer is to no avail? Not according to the scripture. It says things such as, the prayer of a righteous man availeth much. And the prayer of faith can heal the sick. Prayer is not arbitrary. Take God's treatment of Ninevah in the book of Jonah. God's intention was to destroy Ninevah. And God's intention was to spare Ninevah. God's decree was set and unchanging. Ninevah, however had a choice. They could continue on their path and be destroyed, or they could believe God, change their ways and be spared.
Based on God's nature, I see prayer as a means by which we are able to know the will of God. (Romans 12:1-2) If we knew God's will, then we could pray it, and everytime our prayer would be answered. In contrast, we can pray contary to the will of God over and over, and it will be futile. In fact, it won't even be prayer. Prayer is about posturing ourselves to hear God. Not necessarily an audible voice. But, it teaches us to discern God's word, and to apply it in our lives. I think it is pretty evident that we are not operating in an economy like we see evident in the time of the apostles, so to expect such

If God's intention is to heal, then God will supply the prayer of faith to a believer, then that prayer will heal the sick. Prayer is a matter of transforming our minds to know the will of God.

That is without a doubt some of the best explanation I've ever heard on prayer. Thanks J.

RE: Suffering.
The big question right?
Why does God allow/permit suffering?
The question can be answered in a number of ways ranging from our fallen state to free will, BUT if you will allow me a personal observation:

I have noticed something over the years and that is that when there is suffering, be it our lives, the lives of those we know or complete strangers on the other side of the planet, that this is when Human are at their best.
They love without conditions, they give out of love, they truly are acting as one created in Gods Image.
Perhaps suffering is what makes us NOT human but makes us in the Image of Our Creator, A creator God and Son that chose to SUFFER with US, even die FOR Us.
Never are we more noble and Christ like than when others suffer and we help them, that suffering brings us together, strengthens Us, makes us ONE with each other, Just as Christ said we MUST be.
I notice that we are never like that any other time, only when there is suffering.

Food for thought perhaps?