Evidence for God from Science

Posted: **Sat May 05, 2012 9:19 pm**

Hey all,

Recently, I've come across a number of atheist/humanist arguments against Leviticus based on some of the claims they feel are inappropriate given our modern 'sophisticated' view of the world. Ignoring for a moment what CS Lewis dubbed "Chronological Snobbery", I will admit that Leviticus is a difficult book to read (and also one I would not trust non-theologians to handle with any accuracy). That being said, I was wondering if anyone knew of any good resources on the book. Basically anything that puts it into historical perspective and gives some explanation for the claims it makes that are hard to understand from our modern perspective.

There's a picture floating around online that is a response to Dr. Laura Schlesinger (sp?) where a professor (apparently) responds to a statement she made about homosexuality years ago by quoting several verses in Leviticus to make the book look outdated or even bizarre. I guess reading through it, along with other claims I've encountered recently, finally pushed me to want to learn about the book more precisely. So, any information would be appreciated if it's out there! So far I haven't come across much.

Thanks!

Posted: **Sun May 06, 2012 10:02 pm**

A quick google gives me this: http://www.google.com/products/catalog? ... CFUQ8wIwAA

Although I cannot offer any sources that I have read myself, I've always accepted the interpretation that those were the God given guidelines that would ensure the society and culture then would thrive in the context of the specific physical and social environment during that time period. Once society advanced without the need for such drastic measures, God sent Jesus to "fulfill" the law. Now, getting into Heaven has nothing to do with strictly following the Levitical laws and their punishments, but simply putting your Faith in God in contrast to popular belief.

Posted: **Mon May 07, 2012 6:16 am**

Many of the Levitical Laws were oriented towards the "priesthood" ( Levis).
Many of them were "conditional" laws and many were "acommodational laws" and were never meant to be "written in stone" (pardon the pun).
Thing of them as making the best of a bad situation and trying to regulate a people that wanted freedom ( having been oppressed for generations) to do anything they wanted. They were needed to keep Israel "holy" while Israel was doing everything NOT to be holy.

Posted: **Mon May 07, 2012 6:22 pm**

I found this podcast as well (I love listening, but hadn't heard this episode until tonight). He speaks about it towards the middle, after discussing the Dan Savage idiocy that became quite prolific in the news of apologetics in the past couple of weeks:

http://pleaseconvinceme.blogspot.com/20 ... n-non.html

Posted: **Mon May 07, 2012 6:31 pm**

Found this as well, which seems to do a good job summarizing things.

If you want to say homosexuality is wrong based on the O.T. laws, then you must still uphold all of the laws in Leviticus and Deuteronomy.

The Old Testament laws are categorized in three groups: the civil, the priestly, and the moral. The civil laws must be understood in the context of a theocracy. Though the Jewish nation in the Old Testament was often headed by a king, it was a theocratic system with the Scriptures as a guide to the nation. Those laws that fall under this category are not applicable today because we are not under a theocracy.

The priestly laws dealing with the Levitical and Aaronic priesthoods were representative of the future and true High Priest, Jesus, who offered Himself as a sacrifice on the cross. Since Jesus fulfilled the priestly laws, they are no longer necessary to be followed and are not applicable now.

The moral laws, on the other hand, are not abolished because the moral laws are based upon the character of God. Since God's holy character does not change, the moral laws do not change either. Therefore, the moral laws are still in effect.

In the New Testament we do not see a reestablishment of the civil or priestly laws, but we do see a reestablishment of the moral law. This is why we see New Testament condemnation of homosexuality as a sin, but not with the associated death penalty.

Homosexuality is a moral issue.

Posted: **Tue May 08, 2012 3:02 pm**

Wasn't Leviticus written during the exodus, and mainly meant as laws from "god" to try to keep the Israelites united, safe, devoted to their god, and in good health?

Or was it not written in the exodus and my understanding flawed?

Posted: **Wed May 09, 2012 3:02 pm**

Blood wrote:Wasn't Leviticus written during the exodus, and mainly meant as laws from "god" to try to keep the Israelites united, safe, devoted to their god, and in good health?

Or was it not written in the exodus and my understanding flawed?

Just one quick question out of curiousity: Why do you use "god" instead of God? It is a name.

Posted: **Wed May 09, 2012 6:01 pm**

MarcusOfLycia wrote:Just one quick question out of curiousity: Why do you [Blood] use "god" instead of God? It is a name.

Atheists usually write god - lower-case g - as a sign of disrespect for the concept of a deity. That was my justification for doing so when I was an atheist. The smarter atheists will use God because they understand that the God of the Bible is being referred to, just as they will write Allah or Brahman and so on.

Another reason: atheists can handle Allah, Lakshmi, Zeus and other false gods but the real god - God - is so offensive, hence they use the lower-case g.

FL

Posted: **Sat May 12, 2012 9:10 am**

Or you could just be reading to much into his post....

Posted: **Sat May 12, 2012 8:39 pm**

1st- when I said "G-D" I meant no disrespect, I'll be more cautious of this in the future I suppose. I was referring to the judao christian "gee oh d" when I said it.

2nd- I'd actually like someone to answer my question

Posted: **Sun May 13, 2012 5:45 pm**

Blood wrote:1st- when I said "G-D" I meant no disrespect, I'll be more cautious of this in the future I suppose. I was referring to the judao christian "gee oh d" when I said it.

2nd- I'd actually like someone to answer my question

When writing about God, write God, not god. This is more about common sense than respect for God, or lack of it. Example: I have no respect for Allah, but I would never write allah because that would be just incorrect...and stupid.

As for your question, Jesus recognized Moses as author of the Pentateuch* by such phrases as ''Law or the Prophets'' (Mt 5:17) and ''Moses and all the prophets'' (Lk 24:27). ''Law'' and ''Moses'' are used as synonyms here and in other places in the Bible. And remember: Moses died at the end of the Israelites' 40-year journey in the desert on their way to the Promised Land.

FL

*Genesis, Exodus, Leviticus, Numbers, Deuteronomy.

Posted: **Sun May 13, 2012 7:50 pm**

A great book that does much to de-mystify the Old Testament is, "Is God a Moral Monster?" by Paul Copan. It tackles such issues as slavery, atrocities, strange purity laws - much of what makes us scratch our heads, or even recoil, at disturbing mis- or non-understood aspects of the OT. The understandings about slavery alone are worth the price of the book!

You can find it here: http://www.amazon.com/Is-God-Moral-Mons ... 712&sr=1-1

Posted: **Mon May 14, 2012 10:20 am**

Philip wrote:A great book that does much to de-mystify the Old Testament is, "Is God a Moral Monster?" by Paul Copan. It tackles such issues as slavery, atrocities, strange purity laws - much of what makes us scratch our heads, or even recoil, at disturbing mis- or non-understood aspects of the OT. The understandings about slavery alone are worth the price of the book!

You can find it here: http://www.amazon.com/Is-God-Moral-Mons ... 712&sr=1-1

Its an excellent book and Copan is a great apologist.
It gives a certain perspective on things BUT still leaves certain questions and I don't think you'll ever have all the answers anyways, at least not right now

Evidence for God from Science

Resources on Leviticus?

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