Evidence for God from Science

So, I want to present something interesting I thought of one day to you guys and see what you think. I've come to realize that G-d's methods of revelation are threefold and correspond to the three persons of the Trinity.

Now, let's look at revelation. Revelation is any way that G-d communicates to man. When you get down to it, there are three different methods of revelation that G-d seems to have chosen to use. One, is 1) Scripture (2 Timothy 3:16, 2 Peter 3:16). Another is 2) Nature (Job 12:7-8, Psalm 19:1-6, 97:6, Romans 1:18-20). The third is 3) Individual Divine Disclosure (John 14:26, Romans 8:9-14, 1 John 5:6).

The first method, revelation through Scripture, is simply what it sounds like; the Lord's Will, Wisdom, and Truth as revealed in the 66 books of the Bible. The second, nature, is G-d's existence, righteousness, power, and truth as revealed in His whole Creation, the universe. And the third is private, direct revelation given to an individual, which itself can be manifested in a number of ways. It could be as explicit and straightforward as the visions of the prophets as spoken of in Scripture, and it could be as simple and subtle as a sign that's shown to any one of us that we only recognize as a sign from Him because of whatever the sign's meaning is to us personally.

Now, not only is revelation given in three ways, but it's three vehicles correspond to the individual Persons of the Trinity.

In the Trinity, obviously, we have the Three Divine Persons; the first of which is 1) the Father, the next being 2) the Word, and the Third being 3) the Spirit.

Notice how the three in both Trinities correspond. Starting with the first of both, the Scriptures and the Father, let's examine. The Father is the Person of the Trinity that is the G-d of Heaven, outside of and transcendent of the universe. In a similar way, the Scriptures are separate from and outside of us; they're the immutable words of the Living G-d, that are not subject to change through time or physical circumstances. These both are not separate in the sense of being far off from us, but they are separate in both being transcendent, distinct from, and outside of us, time, and change.

Next, we have the second of both groups; Nature and the Word. These two are strikingly complementary, I believe. G-d the Word, or G-d the Son, is G-d Incarnate. Now, this is not simply just Jesus as He was incarnated in the 1st century, but G-d as He's manifested to us throughout all times. Think of the title, the Word. The Word is G-d's action, His Word, His Will as manifested in our world. When G-d interacts in our world, He interacts with His "outstretched arm" or His "hand" (Exodus 6:6, Isaiah 49:22). The idea of the Word of G-d is that He is G-d manifested to us. Yes, this can be as persons, as seen in the Old Testament as the Angel of Hashem and as the Man Jesus, but He is not LIMITED to these. He did work before and after these specific manifestations. Likewise, we can see prophecies concerning the Moshiach as referring to Him as G-d's outstrectched arm (Isaiah 51:9, 53:1). Now, nature is simply G-d's creativity incarnated, is it not? It's the physical manifestation of something of the Divine, of the Will and Mind of G-d, as the Word is the manifestation of the Father.

Now we have the third of both Trinities, individual revelation and guidance, and the Holy Spirit. These two are so similar, or so related, that it's difficult to separate them. The distinction is that individual disclosure and guidance from the Divine is the Action and Result of the Spirit, as the Spirit is fully G-d and coequeal with the Father and Son and not simply a "force." In other words, personal revelation is the WORK of the Spirit. The Holy Spirit dwells within every believer and His indwelling is the Seal that confirms our salvation. He deals with each of us personally and individually, as opposed to the Scriptures and nature, not in that they can't have personal meanings or importance to individuals, but that they're the same for everyone, while the Spirit works exclusively in an individual way.

What do you guys think about this? I feel like I realized something pretty interesting/cool, or I just kind of put too much thought into this.

What do you guys think about this? I feel like I realized something pretty interesting/cool, or I just kind of put too much thought into this.

I don't know what you mean by you put too much thought into this. I think you "realised something pretty interesting" and I was blessed by reading it, which I did a couple of times to make sure of what I was reading. Thanks for sharing that revelation obviously given to you by the Holy Spirit.

Thank you very much, Graceismine. I'm glad this blessed you, and as long as it blessed at least one person, I'm happy to share it.

I think it's a god observation and an important one. Biblicists tend to elevate the first and discount the second and third relative to the first.

Thank you, Canuckster. I'd have to agree. Nature is seen to be only interpreted by the Bible, or more exactly a certain interpretation of the Bible, and personal revelation's "authenticity" is also relative to a certain interpretation of Scripture. I believe G-d's louder than words on a page and is not confined to them, however important and special those words be.

Very nice, I like it.
I have always said that God is revealed to us by Scripture, the Universe we live in and by the HS, I just never assiagned a "role" to each mode of revelation.
Good work.

Thanks a lot, Paul. That's really cool that you've thought the same thing before, the fact that a fellow believer's had the same idea before makes me feel more comfortable with it.

I like your idea and would like to see you develop it further. The only thing I'm concerned about is Individual Divine Disclosure; actually, the term is what bothers me as it may leave the door open to demonic people such as Joseph Smith and Charles Taze Russell to claim special revelation outside of Scripture. However, as long as you insist that IDD must agree with the Word, I guess I could live with the term you coined.

FL

I'm glad to hear you like it, FL. And yes, I would definitely say that any personal revelation would have to agree with the Scriptures. Maybe my wording was a little inadequate, and my apologies if it wasn't clear. I simply meant to convey the truths, guidance, and revelations given by the Spirit to individual believers in a one-on-one, personal way. But nothing involving something that contradicts the Bible, as then that wouldn't be the Spirit of G-d. 1 John 4:1-3 covers that pretty well.

Thanks for the kind words so far everyone, and I hope to hear more.

Interesting idea here. How do you feel about historical and/or group settings. I'm thinking of different creeds or statements of faith, the Nicene Creed for example.

Furstentum Liechtenstein wrote:I like your idea and would like to see you develop it further. The only thing I'm concerned about is Individual Divine Disclosure; actually, the term is what bothers me as it may leave the door open to demonic people such as Joseph Smith and Charles Taze Russell to claim special revelation outside of Scripture. However, as long as you insist that IDD must agree with the Word, I guess I could live with the term you coined.

FL

Here is the thing with "divine individual revelation", it ISN'T suppose to go against scripture ( though it can certainly enlighten it).
And in the case of those two examples, that is what happened.
Of course the issue with personal revelation is that we as fallen humans don't always get the revelation "right".
Revelation is suppose to enlighten and "add" to understanding of scripture.
In the case of Russell he was proven over and over to be a false prophet and his understanding to be in error.

narnia4 wrote:Interesting idea here. How do you feel about historical and/or group settings. I'm thinking of different creeds or statements of faith, the Nicene Creed for example.

Hmm, that's interesting, I hadn't considered that. I suppose it's possible, as the Spirit could certainly speak to multiple people at once, although as I try to think of an example from Scripture, I fail to remember one. Numbers 11:26 and 1 Samuel 10:10 do come to mind, but it's not really clear as to the nature and content of the prophesying. The coming of the Holy Spirit to the believers on Shavuot in Acts 2 also comes to mind, but, this wasn't prophesying, this was speaking in other tongues. Nevertheless, the fact that I can't think of an example from Scripture certainly doesn't mean that it's not possible.
I had more in mind what Paul said in the last post when I was talking about individual revelations, as having the nature of enlightening understanding of the Scriptures or revealing a previously unknown/not understood truth (yet still in accordance with the Bible, obviously). Something that was new, at least to the individual recieving the Spirit's illumination. But, I don't isolate the Spirit's work to that only, as I also include individual guidance as well, such as conviction of sin, giving of strength, endurance, wisdom, and simply leading one's path through parts of one's life, such as one's calling in life, partner, et cetera.
But I'm glad you mentioned this, as I hadn't considered it. I'm happy people are adding in their thoughts.