Evidence for God from Science

Acts 18:27
And when he wished to cross to Achaia, the brothers encouraged him and wrote to the disciples to welcome him. When he arrived, he greatly helped those who through grace had believed,

MH Commentary says:
"Those who believe in Christ, it is through grace that they believe; it is not of themselves, it is God's gift to them; it is his work."

What do you say?

I agree with both the verse and the commentary.

Gods grace is given freely through Christ.
The issue is, for some, to WHOM and HOW.
Some believe it is given to all, but only those that chose to receive it, do. ( Like any gift that it is given, it must be received).
Some believe grace is only given to those that God knows will receive it and how does God know? God has already predetermined them ( Election).
Some will argue that this is not a "gift" since if one is "predetermined" to receive something and can't "reject" it, then it is basically "forced".
Some state that grace is a gift and as such nothing the one does up until the gift is given, can make one earn it ( it is about what Christ DID not what we DO/DID).

The many different understandings lead to their own set of difficulties but I, personally, tend to fall on the side of Grace being a gift freely given to all that seek God through Christ.
It is also given freely to all those that never have the chance to seek God ( for one reason or another) - those that die before the Word has come to them, children to young to seek and understand, the mentally handicapped, etc..

PaulSacramento wrote: The many different understandings lead to their own set of difficulties but I, personally, tend to fall on the side of Grace being a gift freely given to all that seek God through Christ.

Apollos arrived to Achaia and he helped those "who through grace had believed". You say that those people are people who were seeking God through Christ. It means that before there was someone in Achaia who taught them about Christ. Right? Was there someone?

1over137 wrote:

PaulSacramento wrote: The many different understandings lead to their own set of difficulties but I, personally, tend to fall on the side of Grace being a gift freely given to all that seek God through Christ.

Apollos arrived to Achaia and he helped those "who through grace had believed". You say that those people are people who were seeking God through Christ. It means that before there was someone in Achaia who taught them about Christ. Right? Was there someone?

I think that would depend on how you view things so let me make my position a bit more clearer.
Seeking good through Christ does NOT have to mean seeking God though the Christ we have heard about, but seeking God through teachings that "exemplify" Christ.
Jesus taught us many things but they were not all "original" to him, though he did always put a bit "more" on to his teachings making it clear that he was teaching on another level ( the love your enemies is a perfect example of that).
When people seek God though love and compassion they are seeking God through "Christ" even without knowing about Christ because those notions, those feelings, those impluses come from Christ.

Of course one can also accept that the reading f that passage doesn't mean they believed BEFORE Apollos got there, it can be read as they believed by cause they had God's grace in them, the "had" not indicating a "time frame" as such but simply continuing the "past tense" of what Luke was writting about.

I think any Christian would say that it is through God's grace that we believe (have faith). The controversy is in whether that is monergistic or synergistic.
Obviously, we've already had many threads covering this.

Commentaries can be good or bad, so just be careful.
The reality that we have a gospel to believe is evidence of the grace necessary for salvation. God has provided everything necessary for salvation. Faith is impossible apart from grace.

Apollos arrived to Achaia and he helped those "who through grace had believed". You say that those people are people who were seeking God through Christ. It means that before there was someone in Achaia who taught them about Christ. Right? Was there someone?

Absolutely. The Gospel message had spread all the way throughout the Roman empire within 20 years of Christ death. Probably to rome within just the first year of two. One reason was Pentecost. 3,000 Jews from various countries and languages were gathered in Jerusalem on that day. They all returned to their homelands after the . The other is the persecution of the church in Jersulem forced many believers to flee to other areas. Paul wrote the book of Romans to an established Christian church even though he had not been there. But we know from chapter 16 that many other believers had gone there to establish the church.

So I see that this verse also has a synergistic explanation. It can be explained both ways, monergistic and synergistic also. Period.

I remember in my first year of Theology I went to my professor with a "revolutionary: view of what a passage said ( I can't even remember the passge now, LOL) and he turns to me and says " Sometimes a cigar is just a cigar".
He explained that while its fine to look into deeper meanings into verses, that we shoudl FIRST realize what the original author was trying to say about that passage:
Was he making a theological statement or just stating something plainly for his audience.

But when reading this verse I am not sure what the cigar is.

1over137 wrote:But when reading this verse I am not sure what the cigar is.

I don't think Luke was making a theological statement on how and when the believers had gotten God's grace and believed.
Just that they HAD it, had in the since that this (this whole account) had happened in the past and no so much they had it before Apollos arrived.

Best to read the WHOLE relevant passages:
24 Now a Jew named Apollos, an Alexandrian by birth, [d]an eloquent man, came to Ephesus; and he was mighty in the Scriptures. 25 This man had been instructed in the way of the Lord; and being fervent in spirit, he was speaking and teaching accurately the things concerning Jesus, being acquainted only with the baptism of John; 26 and [e]he began to speak out boldly in the synagogue. But when Priscilla and Aquila heard him, they took him aside and explained to him the way of God more accurately. 27 And when he wanted to go across to Achaia, the brethren encouraged him and wrote to the disciples to welcome him; and when he had arrived, he greatly [f]helped those who had believed through grace, 28 for he powerfully refuted the Jews in public, demonstrating by the Scriptures that Jesus was the [g]Christ.

Note that they wrote to the disciples in Achaia to welcome him, there were already disciples there obviously.

PaulSacramento wrote:

1over137 wrote:But when reading this verse I am not sure what the cigar is.

I don't think Luke was making a theological statement on how and when the believers had gotten God's grace and believed.
Just that they HAD it, had in the since that this (this whole account) had happened in the past and no so much they had it before Apollos arrived.

Ok, they had it, and further stuff is only speculation.

1over137 wrote:

PaulSacramento wrote:

1over137 wrote:But when reading this verse I am not sure what the cigar is.

I don't think Luke was making a theological statement on how and when the believers had gotten God's grace and believed.
Just that they HAD it, had in the since that this (this whole account) had happened in the past and no so much they had it before Apollos arrived.

Ok, they had it, and further stuff is only speculation.

Pretty much, which is fine too, nothing wrong with speculation and research, lets just not create or overturn any doctrines because of it, LOL !

PaulSacramento wrote:

1over137 wrote:

PaulSacramento wrote:

1over137 wrote:But when reading this verse I am not sure what the cigar is.

I don't think Luke was making a theological statement on how and when the believers had gotten God's grace and believed.
Just that they HAD it, had in the since that this (this whole account) had happened in the past and no so much they had it before Apollos arrived.

Ok, they had it, and further stuff is only speculation.

Pretty much, which is fine too, nothing wrong with speculation and research, lets just not create or overturn any doctrines because of it, LOL !

That's what I want to avoid - overturning. That's why I ask things.