Evidence for God from Science

Since supposedly there were no other people around when Adam and Eve were created, many believe that Adam and Eve's sons had to have married their sisters to propagate mankind.
This appears further substantiated when Eve is described becoming the mother of all living (Gen 3:20).

I would like to contradict these two perspectives.
First, assuming the fossil record to be correct, that homo sapiens had been around for nearly two hundred thousand years, Adams sons would then have had other people than their sisters to marry.
This is further substantiated when seeing: Who were those that Cain was afraid would slay him after he slew his brother Able (Gen 4:14)?
Obviously this verse infers there were quite a few other people around at the time.
As to Eve representing the mother of all living: As God made man in his (spiritual) image, for God is Spirit (John 4:24); Eve being the mother of all living represents all the spiritually alive with God beings, whereas all other homo sapiens prior to this point would not have had God and would therefore have been animal like and spiritually dead.

There are different views on the subject of course, IMO:
Genesis 4
New American Standard Bible (NASB)
Cain and Abel

4 Now the man [a]had relations with his wife Eve, and she conceived and gave birth to Cain, and she said, “I have gotten a [c]manchild with the help of the Lord.” 2 Again, she gave birth to his brother Abel. And Abel was a keeper of flocks, but Cain was a tiller of the ground. 3 So it came about [d]in the course of time that Cain brought an offering to the Lord of the fruit of the ground. 4 Abel, on his part also brought of the firstlings of his flock and of their fat portions. And the Lord had regard for Abel and for his offering; 5 but for Cain and for his offering He had no regard. So Cain became very angry and his countenance fell. 6 Then the Lord said to Cain, “Why are you angry? And why has your countenance fallen? 7 If you do well, [e]will not your countenance be lifted up? And if you do not do well, sin is crouching at the door; and its desire is for you, but you must master it.” 8 Cain [f]told Abel his brother. And it came about when they were in the field, that Cain rose up against Abel his brother and killed him.

9 Then the Lord said to Cain, “Where is Abel your brother?” And he said, “I do not know. Am I my brother’s keeper?” 10 He said, “What have you done? The voice of your brother’s blood is crying to Me from the ground. 11 Now you are cursed from the ground, which has opened its mouth to receive your brother’s blood from your hand. 12 When you cultivate the ground, it will no longer yield its strength to you; you will be a vagrant and a wanderer on the earth.” 13 Cain said to the Lord, “My punishment is too great to bear! 14 Behold, You have driven me this day from the face of the ground; and from Your face I will be hidden, and I will be a vagrant and a wanderer on the earth, and whoever finds me will kill me.” 15 So the Lord said to him, “Therefore whoever kills Cain, vengeance will be taken on him sevenfold.” And the Lord [g]appointed a sign for Cain, so that no one finding him would slay him.

16 Then Cain went out from the presence of the Lord, and [h]settled in the land of Nod, east of Eden.

17 Cain [j]had relations with his wife and she conceived, and gave birth to Enoch; and he built a city, and called the name of the city Enoch, after the name of his son. 18 Now to Enoch was born Irad, and Irad [k]became the father of Mehujael, and Mehujael [l]became the father of Methushael, and Methushael [m]became the father of Lamech. 19 Lamech took to himself two wives: the name of the one was Adah, and the name of the other, Zillah. 20 Adah gave birth to Jabal; he was the father of those who dwell in tents and have livestock. 21 His brother’s name was Jubal; he was the father of all those who play the lyre and pipe. 22 As for Zillah, she also gave birth to Tubal-cain, the forger of all implements of bronze and iron; and the sister of Tubal-cain was Naamah.

23 Lamech said to his wives,

“Adah and Zillah,
Listen to my voice,
You wives of Lamech,
Give heed to my speech,
For I [n]have killed a man for wounding me;
And a boy for striking me;
24 If Cain is avenged sevenfold,
Then Lamech seventy-sevenfold.”
25 Adam [o]had relations with his wife again; and she gave birth to a son, and named him [p]Seth, for, she said, “God [q]has appointed me another [r]offspring in place of Abel, for Cain killed him.” 26 To Seth, to him also a son was born; and he called his name Enosh. Then men began to call upon the name of the Lord.

Genesis 5
New American Standard Bible (NASB)
Descendants of Adam

5 This is the book of the generations of Adam. In the day when God created man, He made him in the likeness of God. 2 He created them male and female, and He blessed them and named them [a]Man in the day when they were created.

3 When Adam had lived one hundred and thirty years, he became the father of a son in his own likeness, according to his image, and named him Seth. 4 Then the days of Adam after he became the father of Seth were eight hundred years, and he had other sons and daughters. 5 So all the days that Adam lived were nine hundred and thirty years, and he died.

6 Seth lived one hundred and five years, and became the father of Enosh. 7 Then Seth lived eight hundred and seven years after he became the father of Enosh, and he had other sons and daughters. 8 So all the days of Seth were nine hundred and twelve years, and he died.

9 Enosh lived ninety years, and became the father of Kenan. 10 Then Enosh lived eight hundred and fifteen years after he became the father of Kenan, and he had other sons and daughters. 11 So all the days of Enosh were nine hundred and five years, and he died.

12 Kenan lived seventy years, and became the father of Mahalalel. 13 Then Kenan lived eight hundred and forty years after he became the father of Mahalalel, and he had other sons and daughters. 14 So all the days of Kenan were nine hundred and ten years, and he died.

15 Mahalalel lived sixty-five years, and became the father of Jared. 16 Then Mahalalel lived eight hundred and thirty years after he became the father of Jared, and he had other sons and daughters. 17 So all the days of Mahalalel were eight hundred and ninety-five years, and he died.

18 Jared lived one hundred and sixty-two years, and became the father of Enoch. 19 Then Jared lived eight hundred years after he became the father of Enoch, and he had other sons and daughters. 20 So all the days of Jared were nine hundred and sixty-two years, and he died.

21 Enoch lived sixty-five years, and became the father of Methuselah. 22 Then Enoch walked with God three hundred years after he became the father of Methuselah, and he had other sons and daughters. 23 So all the days of Enoch were three hundred and sixty-five years. 24 Enoch walked with God; and he was not, for God took him.

25 Methuselah lived one hundred and eighty-seven years, and became the father of Lamech. 26 Then Methuselah lived seven hundred and eighty-two years after he became the father of Lamech, and he had other sons and daughters. 27 So all the days of Methuselah were nine hundred and sixty-nine years, and he died.

28 Lamech lived one hundred and eighty-two years, and became the father of a son. 29 Now he called his name Noah, saying, “This one will [c]give us rest from our work and from the toil of our hands arising from the ground which the Lord has cursed.” 30 Then Lamech lived five hundred and ninety-five years after he became the father of Noah, and he had other sons and daughters. 31 So all the days of Lamech were seven hundred and seventy-seven years, and he died.

32 Noah was five hundred years old, and Noah became the father of Shem, Ham, and Japheth.

While Genesis 4 and 5 are not explicitily chronological, it seems to imply that:
Cain settled in Nod and had a child from his wife, who he named Enoch.
We can take it as Cain moved to Nod, found a wife and had a kid.
There is no mention of him having a wife before OR that Nod was founded by Cain and seems to state that Nod was already there ( with people presumably).
Now, Genesis 5 gives us a detailed (?) lineage of Adam:
WHile it doesn't mention Cain and Abel, it does mention Seth and that after Seth and during his 930 years he did have:

Then the days of Adam after he became the father of Seth were eight hundred years, and he had other sons and daughters

It seems to imply that after Seth is when Adam and Eve had more children, including some girls.

I find it simple enough to believe that Adam and Eve had daughters (and possibly more sons) than what was recorded. They weren't recorded because they didn't play a roll in the story. The time between the sentace Abel was born and Abel's occupation would have surely allowed time for some wives to be created. Cain was likely married when he murdered, and then he took his wife with him. But he may have gone to Nod and then married her. We can't really know the land of Nod was already settled and named. The writer may have been calling that based on it's name at the time of writing, or based on what it became known as.

Pretty certain it was those Kardashian girls.

jlay wrote:Pretty certain it was those Kardashian girls.

I was gonna say they married their sisters, just like people still do in Tennessee.

Cain did not MARRY anyone, he went to his wife, wife would mean any girl he took to be his partner. Obviously you don't think there was marriage the same way we have today, no paper, no priest, no church, nothing. In those days the best was that the husband paid something to the family of the girl and she was considered a wife.

And as a T.E I think he did not have to marry his sister, there were other people too.

neo-x wrote:Cain did not MARRY anyone, he went to his wife, wife would mean any girl he took to be his partner. Obviously you don't think there was marriage the same way we have today, no paper, no priest, no church, nothing. In those days the best was that the husband paid something to the family of the girl and she was considered a wife.

And as a T.E I think he did not have to marry his sister, there were other people too.

Neo, you bring up an interesting point. What is marriage in God's eyes?

Genesis 2:24:
24 For this reason a man shall leave his father and his mother, and be joined to his wife; and they shall become one flesh.

Well played Rick.
We do have some family trees 'round here that don't fork.

Replying to such an old thread might be interesting.
Adam and Eve's children DID 'marry' each other. If other humans had been created apart from Adam and Eve, it would have been important to record this specifically, since all humans today suffer from Original Sin inherited from Adam and Eve.

If other humans had been created, and they did NOT sin, they would have had a separate line of Blessed Offspring not affected by Original Sin, and we know this is not the case.

The restrictions in place today against close relatives getting married are because of the polluted and corrupted gene pool. The first people would have had no such degeneration, which is also why God allowed them to live for hundreds...even over a thousand years, to give them enough time to propagate and populate the world.

Since I've interacted with this topic in a couple of other threads let me jump in here...

joecap wrote: If other humans had been created apart from Adam and Eve, it would have been important to record this specifically

One could argue (and I do ) that Scripture does make reference to humans who were not genetic descendants of Adam and Eve.
1. Genesis 1:26-27 tells us that God created mankind in his image on Creation 'Day 6' before Adam and Eve show up later in Genesis 2. Scripture does not tell us that Genesis 2 is a recapitulation of the events of Day 6 of Genesis 1. That is a traditional presumption that people have placed upon Scripture. So I believe that the natural sequence of events of Genesis 1 and 2 indicates that the humans created in Genesis 1:26-27 predated Adam and Eve (who appear later in Genesis 2) by some period of time.
2. As was noted in a previous post, the Scriptural sequence of events has Cain banished to Nod before he takes a wife, which at least implies that there were inhabitants in Nod before Cain arrived.
3. Then there are the sons of God and daughters of men in Genesis 6. I believe the 'sons of God' refer to the long lived family line of Adam and Eve while the 'daughters of men' refer to the indigenous inhabitants of Mesopotamia who were not genetic descendants of Adam and Eve and who did not have the long life spans of Adam's line. This would explain why the life span of their offspring dropped to 120 years from the 900 years of the Adamic family line.

So I think there are at least three places where Genesis does refer to humans who were not genetic descendants of Adam and Eve.

since all humans today suffer from Original Sin inherited from Adam and Eve.

All humans do suffer from the effects of Original Sin, but Scripture doesn't describe how Original Sin was passed to all mankind. Scripture just states that the effects of Adam's original sin were passed to all mankind.
It is Augustinian tradition (not Scripture) that tells us that procreation is the transmission mechanism for Original Sin.

If other humans had been created, and they did NOT sin, they would have had a separate line of Blessed Offspring not affected by Original Sin,

Scripture tells us that all men were affected by Adam's original sin (Romans 5:12) and that all have sinned (Romans 3:23), so there is no line of humans who are not affected by sin.

In Christ

DBowling,

This is an interesting topic for me. But, could you explain something about what you wrote here:

DBowling wrote:
Scripture tells us that all men were affected by Adam's original sin (Romans 5:12) and that all have sinned (Romans 3:23), so there is no line of humans who are not affected by sin.

If Adam's sin was the "original sin", or first time a human sinned, and there were other humans who lived before Adam, then they didn't sin?

Romans 3:23 says "all have sinned". If those humans who lived before Adam, didn't sin, then what does that do to Romans 3:23? Or, if those pre-Adam humans DID sin, then how do you explain the story about Adam being the original human sinner?

RickD wrote:DBowling,

This is an interesting topic for me. But, could you explain something about what you wrote here:

DBowling wrote:
Scripture tells us that all men were affected by Adam's original sin (Romans 5:12) and that all have sinned (Romans 3:23), so there is no line of humans who are not affected by sin.

If Adam's sin was the "original sin", or first time a human sinned, and there were other humans who lived before Adam, then they didn't sin?

Romans 3:23 says "all have sinned". If those humans who lived before Adam, didn't sin, then what does that do to Romans 3:23? Or, if those pre-Adam humans DID sin, then how do you explain the story about Adam being the original human sinner?

Hi Rick,

I do not believe humans had the moral capacity to "sin" prior to the Fall. This is based on the following two points.
1. In Genesis 3 we discover that prior to the Fall mankind knew neither good or evil.
2. Romans 5:12 tells us that sin and spiritual death passed among all humanity when Adam sinned.

I also believe that Adam and Eve were the first humans to have a relationship with God, thus making them the first humans capable of good (obeying God) and evil (disobeying God).

So prior to the Fall mankind did not know God, so they didn't have the moral capacity for either good or evil.
I think Romans 5:13-14 speaks to this principle.

13 To be sure, sin was in the world before the law was given, but sin is not charged against anyone’s account where there is no law. 14 Nevertheless, death reigned from the time of Adam to the time of Moses, even over those who did not sin by breaking a command, as did Adam, who is a pattern of the one to come.

In Christ