Westboro and Equality House

[theophilus]

You shall be careful therefore to do as the LORD your God has commanded you. You shall not turn aside to the right hand or to the left.
Deuteronomy 5:32 ESV

God doesn’t simply say we must obey but warns about turning to the right or to the left. That is because there are two opposite ways in which we can disobey each command.

As one example look at what he says about homosexual behavior.

Or do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived: neither the sexually immoral, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor men who practice homosexuality, nor thieves, nor the greedy, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor swindlers will inherit the kingdom of God. And such were some of you. But you were washed, you were sanctified, you were justified in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ and by the Spirit of our God.
1 Corinthians 6:9-11 ESV

Two things are true about it: It is a sin which will keep people out of the kingdom of God but it is no worse that any other sin and like any other sin it can be forgiven. We should love those who practice homosexuality just as we must love those who commit any other sin but we have an obligation to warn them that what they are doing is wrong and to show them how there sin can be forgiven if they repent of it and put their faith in Christ. We must love the sinner but hate the sin.

One error is to hate the sin but to also hate the sinner. Westboro Baptist Church is a perfect example of this. They even named their website godhatesfags.com.

The other error is to love the sinner but also love the sin and fail to warn the sinner that what he is doing is wrong. A good example of this can be found just across the street from Westboro.

A few months back, Aaron Jackson, a 31-year-old Florida resident and the co-founder of the nonprofit group Planting Peace, hopped online, picked himself out a two-bedroom home in Topeka and purchased it for around $80,000, sight unseen.

There were two aspects of the deal that made it significant: 1. This particular house was located directly across the street from the Westboro Baptist Church, the anti-gay outfit that regularly pickets everything from Lady Gaga concerts to the funerals of fallen U.S. soldiers. 2. Upon his arrival, Jackson paid to have his new house painted in the rainbow stripes of the gay pride flag.

In its first few days on display, the list of media outlets that picked up the story reads like a who’s who. The Equality House, so named by the group’s members, showed up in the Washington Post and Time Magazine and on “Good Morning America.”

inkkc.com

I am certain that the members of Equality House love gays and want to help them. They simply don’t realize that by encouraging them to follow a gay lifestyle they are keeping them out of the kingdom of God.

To someone who doesn’t know what the Bible teaches Westboro and Equality House appear to represent different sides in the struggle between good and evil. In fact both are tools being used by Satan in his war against the truth. They are simply attacking from different directions.

For more information on this subject:

http://clydeherrin.wordpress.com/2011/1 ... -of-light/

[neo-x]

Does the gospel say, whoever believes in Christ, and is not gay, is saved?

[RickD]

Does the gospel say, whoever believes in Christ, and is not gay, is saved?

Let's see...

John 3:36:

36 "He who believes in the Son has eternal life ; but he who does not obey the Son will not see life, but the wrath of God abides on him."

John 3:15-16:
15 so that whoever believes will in Him have eternal life. 16 "For God so loved the world, that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him shall not perish, but have eternal life.

John 6:47:
47 "Truly, truly, I say to you, he who believes has eternal life.

I kinda see a theme here...

It seems like scripture says that WHOEVER believes in Christ for salvation HAS eternal life...

[Silvertusk]

To be honest this is an area where I chicken out.

I really do not know.

I have no problem with homosexuals if they are truely in a love relationship and not promiscious. (but then that applies for everyone). I do have a problem with legislation forcing Churches to marry them if they don't want to (they have civil partnerships - which gives the same rights) - or discriminating against the choice of Christian people to not provide services to homosexuals if they decide not to (although this depends on the service, for instance if that Christian is a Doctor he should not deny medical treatment).

I have issues with the whole Gay Pride thing because I think that again promotes promisciousity (again that is not restricted to homosexuals).

I have issues with two gay people adpoting children - because I truly believe a child needs a mother and a father.

But I am not dogmatic about any of these issues and am happy to be convinced otherwise.

I think Westboro church is satanic and should be burnt to the ground and the fact that they dare to call themselves Christians makes me sick to the core.

As far as the Bible goes - God will judge. If the intentions are correct and Love is the prime factor then I do not really see too much of an issue. Just not for me.

[neo-x]

If gays dont go to heaven then i submit that straight christians who engage in anal sex. Whether they believe in christ or not will not enter heaven.

[cubeus19]

Maybe the only people that make it into heaven are the Ami$h.

[neo-x]

Maybe the only people that make it into heaven are the Ami$h.

Yeah...if we start putting up a list of sins then no one gets to heaven. Being gay, if its a sin, is no more a sin than any other sin. If someone believes in Christ but does not go to heaven because he has [enter any sin here] in his life, then we are all done for buddies. Why not pack-up everything and enjoy? We are all up [poop]-creek anyway.

[Danieltwotwenty]

Maybe the only people that make it into heaven are the Ami$h.

Yeah...if we start putting up a list of sins then no one gets to heaven. Being gay, if its a sin, is no more a sin than any other sin. If someone believes in Christ but does not go to heaven because he has [enter any sin here] in his life, then we are all done for buddies. Why not pack-up everything and enjoy? We are all up [poop]-creek anyway.

Amen Neo-X

How easily we forget our own constant sinning by shifting the focus onto another's sin.

Do we forget so easily why Christ had to come, do we forget that God loves, accepts, forgives (those that ask) equally.

Dan

[neo-x]

Maybe the only people that make it into heaven are the Ami$h.

Yeah...if we start putting up a list of sins then no one gets to heaven. Being gay, if its a sin, is no more a sin than any other sin. If someone believes in Christ but does not go to heaven because he has [enter any sin here] in his life, then we are all done for buddies. Why not pack-up everything and enjoy? We are all up [poop]-creek anyway.

Amen Neo-X

How easily we forget our own constant sinning by shifting the focus onto another's sin.

Do we forget so easily why Christ had to come, do we forget that God loves, accepts, forgives (those that ask) equally.

Dan

Exactly Dan. Well said.

The thing is, the moment you put up a condition on grace and salvation, you have already made a gigantic addition to the gospel.

Gays can be christians but not saved...this is no more different then saying liars can be christians but not saved. You are not saved because you don't do anal sex, neither you are saved because you don't lie, you tell the truth.

You are saved because Christ died for you. To that, one can not assign any condition which is higher than life and for that our gracious lord himself died to seal it forever.

[neo-x]

To be honest this is an area where I chicken out. I really do not know.

you don't have to.

I have no problem with homosexuals if they are truely in a love relationship and not promiscious. (but then that applies for everyone). I do have a problem with legislation forcing Churches to marry them if they don't want to (they have civil partnerships - which gives the same rights) - or discriminating against the choice of Christian people to not provide services to homosexuals if they decide not to (although this depends on the service, for instance if that Christian is a Doctor he should not deny medical treatment).
.

I understand ST. And am with you on this one.

have issues with the whole Gay Pride thing because I think that again promotes promisciousity (again that is not restricted to homosexuals).

True, so this is not the issue.

I have issues with two gay people adpoting children - because I truly believe a child needs a mother and a father.

i think the same way though honestly single parents are the norm, its better to have two people rather than one in my opinion.

But I am not dogmatic about any of these issues and am happy to be convinced otherwise.

We don't have to congratulate them, just live and let live.

I think Westboro church is satanic and should be burnt to the ground and the fact that they dare to call themselves Christians makes me sick to the core.

I think it serves as a fine example of being called christians without remotely displaying anything that resembles the nature of Christ.

Our fight is not with flesh and blood
...and yet we constantly make a point of doing exactly that.

[theophilus]

Does the gospel say, whoever believes in Christ, and is not gay, is saved?

No, anyone who repents and believes in Christ will be saved regardless of whether he is gay or straight. Equality House teaches gays that their lifestyle isn't a sin. This keeps many gays from being saved because it keeps them from realizing that they need to be saved. Here is a good place to learn more about homosexuality from a Christian perspective:

http://truefreedomtrust.co.uk/

True freedom Trust (TfT) is a confidential Christian support and teaching ministry for men and women who accept the Bible's prohibition of same-sex practice and yet are aware of same-sex attractions, or struggle with other sexual and relational issues. We also offer support to families, friends and church leaders of those who face these issues in their lives.

[Alpha~Omega]

I think something that needs to be kept in mind that there is a big difference between a Christian who struggles with homosexuality, and a man who accepts it as something non-sinful, yet calls him self a christian.

The key word here is STRUGGLES, rather then accept the sin. Just like we all must struggle with certain sins. Maybe this is what you guys meant, but I was unable to extract that.

[Murray]

Well jesus speaks about sexual immorality in Mark 7:20-23 (and other verses i don't remember) and sexual immorality is defined pretty in depth in leviticus 18 (18:22 if you want to be exact about homosexuality). So when jesus speaks about "sexual immorality" we should probably look at where jesus defines it from (god's words in leviticus).

So yes it's not a god pleasing lifestyle and a christian who is led by the spirit and gay should eventually struggle with his sexual preference as his faith grows and he is led by the spirit ( Hebrews 5:11-14).

Let the spirit work in a gay christian, because the spirit has the power and authority to change that person not you. I have at least 4 gay christians in a bible study I help lead and I don't encourage homosexuality and i sure as heck don't CONDEM THEM AS A PERSON for it. Sometimes leading a person from sin can be as simple as guiding them towards the spirit.

My pastor straightened me out on this as he's has multiple gay christians come to him on their own free will to ask for help changing their lifestyle. That will to change did not come from a person condemning them, but rather the spirit guiding them.

And why do we still even talk about the WBC. They're just a bunch of hate filled demons doing their best to turn others away from christ and every time we mention them we're giving them exactly what they want, attention.

They're just like kim jong-un and north korea; when they stop getting attention they do something outrageous and stupid so people will talk about them again.

[Danieltwotwenty]

Well jesus speaks about sexual immorality in Mark 7:20-23 (and other verses i don't remember) and sexual immorality is defined pretty in depth in leviticus 18 (18:22 if you want to be exact about homosexuality). So when jesus speaks about "sexual immorality" we should probably look at where jesus defines it from (god's words in leviticus).

So yes it's not a god pleasing lifestyle and a christian who is led by the spirit and gay should eventually struggle with his sexual preference as his faith grows and he is led by the spirit ( Hebrews 5:11-14).

Let the spirit work in a gay christian, because the spirit has the power and authority to change that person not you. I have at least 4 gay christians in a bible study I help lead and I don't encourage homosexuality and i sure as heck don't CONDEM THEM AS A PERSON for it. Sometimes leading a person from sin can be as simple as guiding them towards the spirit.

My pastor straightened me out on this as he's has multiple gay christians come to him on their own free will to ask for help changing their lifestyle. That will to change did not come from a person condemning them, but rather the spirit guiding them.

And why do we still even talk about the WBC. They're just a bunch of hate filled demons doing their best to turn others away from christ and every time we mention them we're giving them exactly what they want, attention.

They're just like kim jong-un and north korea; when they stop getting attention they do something outrageous and stupid so people will talk about them again.