Evidence for God from Science

The reason I ask this is because over the past few years I've studied some amazing evidences for Christianity specifically things like the Shroud of Turin that appear to be smoking gun and magic bullet evidences for Christianity that if they were studied more and were promoted more by big name apologetics organizations would in my mind completely defeat the atheist side and bring untold numbers of people to Christ.

The problem that I currently think is preventing this is both the leaders in the atheist and Christian organizations are knowingly or unknowingly working with each other not to let either side get far too ahead in the overall debate. The reason being coming from a not a genuine desire to win people to either side but strictly from a BUSINESS perspective. By both sides holding all their cards back and letting the debate continue and to always continue means consumer demand will continue to remain high. Which means, both sides will be able to continue selling books, dvds, hold debates, presentations and anything else that helps pad their pockets.

Now if you are an atheist organization why not? I mean after all, greed and the uncontrolled desire and ability to get as much money as you can is in and of itself, a natural by result of the atheist worldview and the paradigm of methodological naturalism. But on the flip side, some of the disturbing things I see in a few apologetics organizations that I really like and for the most part fully support is many of them love to have these cruise ship meetings.

Which to me, there is nothing wrong with going on a cruise, but when you use money that you could have used to help save the lost or to directly help believers get closer to God you instead blow all that money on a big cruise. It's something I have seen in regular ministries like with many popular televangelists and sadly I'm afraid that many apologetics organizations have got that same itch to get rich and thus give God the cold shoulder for the all mighty dollar.

Now I was wondering, do you all see this same trend with many of the apologetics organizations that you follow? Do you think that with them it really is all about the money and not about winning the lost? Which ones do you think are more like this and which ones are less like this? In many ways I hope I am wrong about this assessment of apologetics organizations and if you think I am please show me because if so, I'm really hoping you are right.

Another thing I ask regarding this is, do you see any of these trends specifically with foreign missions organizations? We need to find rat out any of the ones who are in it for the cash and only support the ones who by all means are in it to win the lost and to help believers get closer to God. So if you all know of any that you trust, don't trust or want to show me where I'm wrong in this assessment please let me know. Thank you all for your time. GB.

DRDS wrote:Now if you are an atheist organization why not? I mean after all, greed and the uncontrolled desire and ability to get as much money as you can is in and of itself, a natural by result of the atheist worldview and the paradigm of methodological naturalism. But on the flip side, some of the disturbing things I see in a few apologetics organizations that I really like and for the most part fully support is many of them love to have these cruise ship meetings.

Which to me, there is nothing wrong with going on a cruise, but when you use money that you could have used to help save the lost or to directly help believers get closer to God you instead blow all that money on a big cruise. It's something I have seen in regular ministries like with many popular televangelists and sadly I'm afraid that many apologetics organizations have got that same itch to get rich and thus give God the cold shoulder for the all mighty dollar.

If this is true about those organizations then

But also in my country why some organizations that are to help the poor and sick, have expensive dinners in expensive hotels? Well, I know, but ...

Hey DRDS, it's me ManofGod I definitely can't say your wrong in your assesment. I can't name any organizations off the top of my head, but I would'nt be a bit surprised that there are some apologetic organizations who follow the same dreaded path of televangical pastor. Just like my dad says, if there is a lot of money involved in anything, things can oftentimes get dirty I'll see if I can research some larger organizations' finincial workings and inform you on their workings concerning money.

Yeah I'm mainly trying to figure out which ones I can give to knowing that what I give really does go toward helping people whether it be reaching the lost or helping inform or encouraging believers. And it's not just apologetics organizations but also missionary organizations. Ones that I'm really wanting to know more about as far as where their money goes are the ones I've given to in the past like IMB International Missions Board, Reasonable Faith (William Lane Craig's organization), and STR Stand to Reason (Greg Koukl's ministry).

I was also wondering, if people give to ministries not knowing or not being able to know where their money goes to and it turns out they are giving to a organization that is using the funds for selfish reasons, if that person never finds out about that but continues to give thinking they are indeed helping the lost, do you think God will still give such people credit for their giving? A good example would be many of those poor old women who give their life savings to people like Benny Hinn and thinking that they are truly giving to God, but of course, in reality, they are just helping pad Hinn's big pockets.

But if anyone else has any additional input concerning good ministries to give to and others to avoid, please feel free to let me know. Thank you all for your time.

I believe good ministry is neo-x's ministry. Feel free to check Prayer Requests forum and the thread Prayer's for neo-x's ministry.

I'll need to look into it sometime. Does he have a website, fb page, or any contact info? Thanks.

Wouldn't the apologetic organizations that are greedy still want to convert people to become believers? They'd be easier to manipulate, it'd be easier to get them to tithe, volunteer, and buy Bibles and books about the Bible. That's my take anyway.

To give you all a update, I asked a few people on social media about some of the things I mentioned in the OP and got some very helpful answers that helped clear some things up for me. So for the most part, I consider this issue solved.

I donate regularly to ReasonableFaith - Craigs organisation as he makes most of his material free and there is a wealth of it,

Yeah, I've done the same, WLC is a good ole boy by bean jeebers! (as we say in southeast KENTUCK!)