Evidence for God from Science

For example, let's say I murder an enemy in a video game, is this sin? Do the internal coding of the game and the pixels on the screen that represent fictional stories and characters that don't exist become sinful? Does the unreality become real?

Let's move on to another example, let's just say we have an artist draw pornographic material, is this sinful? Do the lines and color that represent an action that doesn't actually exist become sinful?

Can nonexistence become sinful? Can we sin by thinking of the nonexistent? How about nonexistent actions such as fictional murder or sex?

Matthew 5:27-28

We have the ability to bring things into reality from our mind. But our mind is real. What we think and dwell on is real to us and moves us on future thoughts/acts. So those 'nonexistent' 'things' you talk about, are not actually nonexistent. They are existent in thought (genesis of thought, and dwelling of thought).

For example, let's say I murder an enemy in a video game, is this sin?

If it was murder, yes. If it was self-defence, no. If you are 'roleplaying' a Christian in game, then you would better avoid sin, which would in turn limit your choices in game, or the games you play.

artist draw pornographic material, is this sinful?

Yes. It was generated by a lustful mind. The lines/color is the form of this created thought which is lust which is adultery to God.

Bluejay4 wrote:For example, let's say I murder an enemy in a video game, is this sin? Do the internal coding of the game and the pixels on the screen that represent fictional stories and characters that don't exist become sinful? Does the unreality become real?

Let's move on to another example, let's just say we have an artist draw pornographic material, is this sinful? Do the lines and color that represent an action that doesn't actually exist become sinful?

Can nonexistence become sinful? Can we sin by thinking of the nonexistent? How about nonexistent actions such as fictional murder or sex?

Php 4:8 ESV, Finally, brothers, whatever is true, whatever is honorable, whatever is just, whatever is pure, whatever is lovely, whatever is commendable, if there is any excellence, if there is anything worthy of praise, think about these things.

Rom 12:2-3 ESV, Do not be conformed to this world, but be transformed by the renewal of your mind, that by testing you may discern what is the will of God, what is good and acceptable and perfect. 3 For by the grace given to me I say to everyone among you not to think of himself more highly than he ought to think, but to think with sober judgment, each according to the measure of faith that God has assigned.

Is a violent murderous video game just, pure, lovely, commendable, praise worthy, honorable, truth?
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Mallz wrote:Matthew 5:27-28

We have the ability to bring things into reality from our mind. But our mind is real. What we think and dwell on is real to us and moves us on future thoughts/acts. So those 'nonexistent' 'things' you talk about, are not actually nonexistent. They are existent in thought (genesis of thought, and dwelling of thought).

For example, let's say I murder an enemy in a video game, is this sin?

If it was murder, yes. If it was self-defence, no. If you are 'roleplaying' a Christian in game, then you would better avoid sin, which would in turn limit your choices in game, or the games you play.

artist draw pornographic material, is this sinful?

Yes. It was generated by a lustful mind. The lines/color is the form of this created thought which is lust which is adultery to God.

But that's the thing, we have lines on a paper and code in some hardware..the murder and sex don't exist. When we think of them were not thinking about murder or sex...because the things we saw didn't actually happen. It seems odd that God would punish "sin" that didn't actually happen, which unlike in thoughts we actually can commit adultery because our thoughts are real, code and pretty images are not. Do you get what I'm saying?

B. W. wrote:

Bluejay4 wrote:For example, let's say I murder an enemy in a video game, is this sin? Do the internal coding of the game and the pixels on the screen that represent fictional stories and characters that don't exist become sinful? Does the unreality become real?

Let's move on to another example, let's just say we have an artist draw pornographic material, is this sinful? Do the lines and color that represent an action that doesn't actually exist become sinful?

Can nonexistence become sinful? Can we sin by thinking of the nonexistent? How about nonexistent actions such as fictional murder or sex?

Php 4:8 ESV, Finally, brothers, whatever is true, whatever is honorable, whatever is just, whatever is pure, whatever is lovely, whatever is commendable, if there is any excellence, if there is anything worthy of praise, think about these things.

Rom 12:2-3 ESV, Do not be conformed to this world, but be transformed by the renewal of your mind, that by testing you may discern what is the will of God, what is good and acceptable and perfect. 3 For by the grace given to me I say to everyone among you not to think of himself more highly than he ought to think, but to think with sober judgment, each according to the measure of faith that God has assigned.

Is a violent murderous video game just, pure, lovely, commendable, praise worthy, honorable, truth?
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Well...sometimes?

But that's the thing, we have lines on a paper and code in some hardware..the murder and sex don't exist. When we think of them were not thinking about murder or sex...because the things we saw didn't actually happen. It seems odd that God would punish "sin" that didn't actually happen, which unlike in thoughts we actually can commit adultery because our thoughts are real, code and pretty images are not. Do you get what I'm saying?

The murder and sex do exist. Doesn't matter what form it comes in (pictures/programming code/movies/etc.). I get it's a fictional character. I think you might be thinking too light on what sin is and how it is viewed..? What is sin to you? And He judges not just the sin, but the motives behind it. And depending on the reason for the sin and how it was carried out, His judgment will either be light or hard. When you think about it, it's really a persons soul that is being judged and sin is the expression of a maligned heart that causes God to judge the soul. It's all about you, what your thoughts are, and why you do what you do.

There was a tv series called 'humans'... basically it was set in the near future where you could buy robots to help you e.g round the house with chores. Anyway these robots looked and acted like humans. Some even had 'consciousness'

One husband ended up having sex with the family robot. She was one of the ones with consciousness. Is that adultery? At first he tried to make it sound like it was nothing more than MB but it was clear to the rest of the family that it was adultery not some 'fictional' sin that didnt really involve anyone else. They had come to 'love' the new robot and treated her like a family member even before they knew she was 'self aware'.

We try at times to justify sin. Excuse it. Lessen it. Sin is sin.

Mallz wrote:

But that's the thing, we have lines on a paper and code in some hardware..the murder and sex don't exist. When we think of them were not thinking about murder or sex...because the things we saw didn't actually happen. It seems odd that God would punish "sin" that didn't actually happen, which unlike in thoughts we actually can commit adultery because our thoughts are real, code and pretty images are not. Do you get what I'm saying?

The murder and sex do exist. Doesn't matter what form it comes in (pictures/programming code/movies/etc.). I get it's a fictional character. I think you might be thinking too light on what sin is and how it is viewed..? What is sin to you? And He judges not just the sin, but the motives behind it. And depending on the reason for the sin and how it was carried out, His judgment will either be light or hard. When you think about it, it's really a persons soul that is being judged and sin is the expression of a maligned heart that causes God to judge the soul. It's all about you, what your thoughts are, and why you do what you do.

I think it does, if the percieved "sin" happened in a reality that doesn't exist, then logic says the sin didn't exist. How can nonexistent characters made up of unliving code and pixels miss the mark of God if they don't even exist? How can I miss the mark by "stealing" from something I didn't actually steal from?

Because you revel in the sin of it? Use it as a way of sining without actually commiting the sin?
It does exist...just not in the physical world you inhabit.
The characters and pixels are real in thought.

Storyteller wrote:Because you revel in the sin of it? Use it as a way of sining without actually commiting the sin?
It does exist...just not in the physical world you inhabit.
The characters and pixels are real in thought.

If no sin exists in the first place then there's no issue, but that's sort of the root of the problem. How does sin transcend nonexistence? How does God deal with this type of sin? Punish pixels for doing what they've been programmed to? How does God punish a non living entity in the first place? I can't understand why God would punish fake theft, murder, sex...at least if you don't become obsessed with it and don't act out on it.

I am exploring this, I dont know the answers, its all on the hoof.

I love reading thrillers, murder stories, I am fascinated by pyschopaths, sociopaths and the like, but...
I think in a I want to understand rather than enjoyment.

Pixels etc arent made in the image of God but in the image of mans desire and sin (sometimes). Up to us whether we endorse it.

Storyteller wrote:

I love reading thrillers, murder stories, I am fascinated by pyschopaths, sociopaths and the like, but...
I think in a I want to understand rather than enjoyment.

Remind me to stay out of your closet!

RickD wrote:

Storyteller wrote:

I love reading thrillers, murder stories, I am fascinated by pyschopaths, sociopaths and the like, but...
I think in a I want to understand rather than enjoyment.

Remind me to stay out of your closet!

Bluejay4, God doesn't punish the pixels.. He punishes the people who created it and who are engaging in it . The minds that bring it (movies/games/books/etc) into this existence in a form (pixels, colors, lines, etc.), and the minds that engage in it.

We don't do anything without first thinking of it. A lot of things can be done automatically through behavior programming (you don't realize your thinking about something before doing [aka it's 'natural' for you to do]), and through autonomic processes from your brain (the process is there, your conscious just has nothing to do with it [although can effect it..]). So, what you dwell in, you lean towards becoming. The more you engage, the more you become. And that is when you see kids who grew up their whole life in fantasy/virtual worlds lose touch with reality and die charging a cop with a broad sword.

Your getting too fixated on the expression of sin, not who is responsible for it and who keeps it alive (it's life is virtual). Who makes these things? Who engages in them? People. People are responsible for the murder in games, either creating it for others to do, or for just engaging in and doing it. This is all virtual, so the sin is dealt with on the level of the heart.

Do you not know you will be judged for your thoughts?