Evidence for God from Science

Okay, an insight into my crazy world of thoughts...

Nothing. What is it? Does it exist? If there is nothing then it has to be something that doesn`t exist otherwise it`s something so it exists, it wouldn`t be nothing.

Anything that exists we can think of.... can we think of nothing? We can think of emptiness, darkness, a void, maybe a vaccum but they are all something. What, exactly, is nothing?

If, we accept that nothing is something that doesn`t exist, we cannot think of nothing then does it not stand to reason that anything we can think of does exist? If so, Ta Dah!! I have just proved God exists.

I did tell you I have some crazy thoughts, though I do admit, it thought better than it looks in type.

Earlier you said you weren't harmed by those mushrooms you ate. You sure bout that?

Nothing isn't something, it's nothing.

And our mind isn't quite powerful enough to imagine things into existence. Contrary to what some might say.

Storyteller wrote:Okay, an insight into my crazy world of thoughts...

Nothing. What is it? Does it exist? If there is nothing then it has to be something that doesn`t exist otherwise it`s something so it exists, it wouldn`t be nothing.

Anything that exists we can think of.... can we think of nothing? We can think of emptiness, darkness, a void, maybe a vaccum but they are all something. What, exactly, is nothing?

If, we accept that nothing is something that doesn`t exist, we cannot think of nothing then does it not stand to reason that anything we can think of does exist? If so, Ta Dah!! I have just proved God exists.

I did tell you I have some crazy thoughts, though I do admit, it thought better than it looks in type.

Have you been listening to Lawrence Krauss about nothing? Even if you have? You are right.But now Jerry Coyne is claiming we have no free-will and we cannot make our own choices.How are we going to convince atheists they can make a choice to believe in God,that God gave them free-will? I don't see crazy thoughts from you,its them with the crazy thoughts.

Who?

Nope, was just pondering in the early hours, came up with it all by myself

As for convincing atheists that they have free will, well it`s obvious that they have free will precisely because they can choose to not believe in God.

Have you got any links to this Krauss guy? I`d love to see what he thinks. It`s weird, sometimes I think about something, think "Ooooooo, that`s an interesting thought, wonder if it might be true" then I discover that someone else has beaten me to it and already thought of it!

can we think of nothing?

No, because as you said, then it would immediately become something.
Nothing is just a word used to try and explain relation with something that used to not exist. And even then, I'd argue it still had 'existence' in Him before being actualized (a concept I'm flushing out. Can't elaborate much here, yet).

Unicorns don't exist

Mallz wrote:

can we think of nothing?

No, because as you said, then it would immediately become something.
Nothing is just a word used to try and explain relation with something that used to not exist. And even then, I'd argue it still had 'existence' in Him before being actualized (a concept I'm flushing out. Can't elaborate much here, yet).

Unicorns don't exist

So if it`s not possible to say that nothing exists, then it can`t be said that God doesn`t exist, can it? Only that we don`t believe He doesn`t (obviously I mean they, not me) Kinda like, I don`t believe the yeti exists but I couldn`t say he doesn`t.

And unicorns don`t exist? Nooooooooo, tell me it`s not true!
What about dragons?

PS Can`t wait for you to elaborate!

So if it`s not possible to say that nothing exists, then it can`t be said that God doesn`t exist, can it? Only that we don`t believe He doesn`t (obviously I mean they, not me) Kinda like, I don`t believe the yeti exists but I couldn't say he doesn`t.

It can be said that God doesn't exist, just like how one can say nothing exists :-p It doesn't make it true, though.
Nothing is one of those terms like random that only make sense from a creatures perspective.
There's no reasonable evidence or logical reasoning the yeti exists (even though I've looked for him as an Oregonian). There is for God. So there's a difference there. And anyone who would take the time to explore the foundations of reality would realize that no, you can't say God doesn't exist, people can only believe He doesn't.

What about dragons?

They used to
Job 41:18 Its snorting throws out flashes of light;
its eyes are like the rays of dawn.
19 Flames stream from its mouth;
sparks of fire shoot out.
20 Smoke pours from its nostrils
as from a boiling pot over burning reeds.
21 Its breath sets coals ablaze,
and flames dart from its mouth.

Mallz wrote:

So if it`s not possible to say that nothing exists, then it can`t be said that God doesn`t exist, can it? Only that we don`t believe He doesn`t (obviously I mean they, not me) Kinda like, I don`t believe the yeti exists but I couldn't say he doesn`t.

It can be said that God doesn't exist, just like how one can say nothing exists :-p It doesn't make it true, though.
Nothing is one of those terms like random that only make sense from a creatures perspective.
There's no reasonable evidence or logical reasoning the yeti exists (even though I've looked for him as an Oregonian). There is for God. So there's a difference there. And anyone who would take the time to explore the foundations of reality would realize that no, you can't say God doesn't exist, people can only believe He doesn't.

What about dragons?

They used to
Job 41:18 Its snorting throws out flashes of light;
its eyes are like the rays of dawn.
19 Flames stream from its mouth;
sparks of fire shoot out.
20 Smoke pours from its nostrils
as from a boiling pot over burning reeds.
21 Its breath sets coals ablaze,
and flames dart from its mouth.

Can we really say that nothing exists though? If there is nothing, then there is something isn`t there?

Re the dragons.....


I love to think that these creatures did, once, exist. I really like dragons. There was an author Anne MacCaffrey who did a series about dragons - The Dragonriders of Pern. I adore them. These dragonriders impress their dragons at a hatching and the stories are enchanting. Makes me pine for a dragon of my own. especially as it appears I can`t have a unicorn

Storyteller wrote:

Mallz wrote:

can we think of nothing?

No, because as you said, then it would immediately become something.
Nothing is just a word used to try and explain relation with something that used to not exist. And even then, I'd argue it still had 'existence' in Him before being actualized (a concept I'm flushing out. Can't elaborate much here, yet).

Unicorns don't exist

So if it`s not possible to say that nothing exists, then it can`t be said that God doesn`t exist, can it? Only that we don`t believe He doesn`t (obviously I mean they, not me) Kinda like, I don`t believe the yeti exists but I couldn`t say he doesn`t.

And unicorns don`t exist? Nooooooooo, tell me it`s not true!
What about dragons?

PS Can`t wait for you to elaborate!

We cannot comprehend nothingness simply due to not only the existence of God, but precisely because God IS existence.

Story, do yourself a favor and read up on divine simplicity. I would highly recommend a paper written by none other than our own resident philosopher Jac (PDF download link ).

Byblos wrote:

Storyteller wrote:

Mallz wrote:

can we think of nothing?

No, because as you said, then it would immediately become something.
Nothing is just a word used to try and explain relation with something that used to not exist. And even then, I'd argue it still had 'existence' in Him before being actualized (a concept I'm flushing out. Can't elaborate much here, yet).

Unicorns don't exist

So if it`s not possible to say that nothing exists, then it can`t be said that God doesn`t exist, can it? Only that we don`t believe He doesn`t (obviously I mean they, not me) Kinda like, I don`t believe the yeti exists but I couldn`t say he doesn`t.

And unicorns don`t exist? Nooooooooo, tell me it`s not true!
What about dragons?

PS Can`t wait for you to elaborate!

We cannot comprehend nothingness simply due to not only the existence of God, but precisely because God IS existence.

Story, do yourself a favor and read up on divine simplicity. I would highly recommend a paper written by none other than our own resident philosopher Jac (PDF download link ).

Will do Byblos, and thank you Jac`s book has been on my reading list for a while. I am currently reading Four Loves by C.S. Lewis, nearly done so when I`ve finished that I will get stuck into Jacs book, probably over Christmas.

Storyteller wrote:Who?

Nope, was just pondering in the early hours, came up with it all by myself

As for convincing atheists that they have free will, well it`s obvious that they have free will precisely because they can choose to not believe in God.

Have you got any links to this Krauss guy? I`d love to see what he thinks. It`s weird, sometimes I think about something, think "Ooooooo, that`s an interesting thought, wonder if it might be true" then I discover that someone else has beaten me to it and already thought of it!

Krauss wrote a book called "A Universe From Nothing"