Evidence for God from Science

I have often been troubled by this notion of women causing men to stumble. It just never sat right with me. I'm aware that we live in a society that is extremely sexualised and fashion seems to be very provocative but not all the time it depends what's in trend. It's also about common sense, swimsuit is okay at the beach, not so okay at the supermarket. No different for men, put a shirt on when you're out for lunch, at the shops ect.
As Christians both men and women, our standard has to be measured by our own common sense and what we find acceptable for ourselves, spouses and God.
There are many Christians and by Christians I mean mostly men who seem to grade a woman's spirituality by her clothing attire. 'You wouldn't want to 'cause' a man to stumble'.
Apparently the latest assault on women's attire is the yoga pant, or gym pant.
If anyone has done yoga, a spin class, step class, Pilates ect, a little house on the prairie dress just ain't going to cut it.
In saying that teeny tiny shorts with your bum hanging out topped with a boob tube which I have seen women wear to these classes is just as ridiculous and completely impractical.
It's about personal responsibility.
If anyone male or female has issues with lust then that is their own weakness best dealt with by laying it before God and accepting responsibility instead of blaming and defaming others.
The names that these woman and often girls are sometimes called is a disgrace or the assumptions made about them, done so by Christian men who are only doing so because of their own weakness an inability to face their own demons. It's easier to blame a woman for wearing yoga pants too tight than to took at yourself honestly and authentically and to address that you have an issue.
Lust is very different to finding someone attractive. Part of our human condition is to find pleasure in beauty. It's not a sin to think someone of the opposite sex is attractive or beautiful. To recognise that they have a great smile, athletic body, beautiful hair or whatever.
Lust is when those thoughts turn deviant and lewd.
When the imagination takes those thoughts to a place they shouldn't go, it is a self gratifying and self serving desire. It has nothing to do with the other person and everything to do with ourselves.
It is not the fault of the busty woman with the low cut top, or the muscular man parading around with his shirt off.
I'm not arguing wether it's morally okay for people to dress a certain way, that is a different discussion. Yes, there are people out there who dress in a way to deliberately sexually exploit themselves and others, but those people represent quite a small percentage of the population.
I'm talking about the woman with the gym pants on, the summer dress that sits above the knee, the top that shows some cleavage.
I'm not happy with the whole, women watch yourselves you may cause a man to stumble line. How about the men watch themselves, if they are stumbling best to pick your own feet up a little rather than looking to throw the blame around.

Wholeheartedly agreed.

melanie wrote:I have often been troubled by this notion of women causing men to stumble.

Is that an Australian saying? I can't say I've ever heard of that. I know that behind every great man is a great woman, and behind every great woman is a great man checking out her great behind.

melanie wrote: It just never sat right with me. I'm aware that we live in a society that is extremely sexualised and fashion seems to be very provocative but not all the time it depends what's in trend. It's also about common sense, swimsuit is okay at the beach, not so okay at the supermarket. No different for men, put a shirt on when you're out for lunch, at the shops ect.
As Christians both men and women, our standard has to be measured by our own common sense and what we find acceptable for ourselves, spouses and God.
There are many Christians and by Christians I mean mostly men who seem to grade a woman's spirituality by her clothing attire. 'You wouldn't want to 'cause' a man to stumble'.

Ah, I think I hear you now.

melanie wrote: Apparently the latest assault on women's attire is the yoga pant, or gym pant.
If anyone has done yoga, a spin class, step class, Pilates ect, a little house on the prairie dress just ain't going to cut it.
In saying that teeny tiny shorts with your bum hanging out topped with a boob tube which I have seen women wear to these classes is just as ridiculous and completely impractical.

I have actually talked to women candidly about this subject, specifically yoga pants. The consensus is actually quite positive: girls like yoga pants because they are comfortable and look good, and guys like yoga pants because they look good. It's a big win-win.

melanie wrote: It's about personal responsibility.
If anyone male or female has issues with lust then that is their own weakness best dealt with by laying it before God and accepting responsibility instead of blaming and defaming others.
The names that these woman and often girls are sometimes called is a disgrace or the assumptions made about them, done so by Christian men who are only doing so because of their own weakness an inability to face their own demons. It's easier to blame a woman for wearing yoga pants too tight than to took at yourself honestly and authentically and to address that you have an issue.
Lust is very different to finding someone attractive. Part of our human condition is to find pleasure in beauty. It's not a sin to think someone of the opposite sex is attractive or beautiful. To recognise that they have a great smile, athletic body, beautiful hair or whatever.

Precisely. I myself am a sucker for women in dresses, it's just the most flattering and feminine item of clothing I think a woman can wear. But I am still obligated to behave like a gentleman no matter if she is wearing a shawl or a burqa.

melanie wrote: Lust is when those thoughts turn deviant and lewd.
When the imagination takes those thoughts to a place they shouldn't go, it is a self gratifying and self serving desire. It has nothing to do with the other person and everything to do with ourselves.
It is not the fault of the busty woman with the low cut top, or the muscular man parading around with his shirt off.

Right once again.

melanie wrote: I'm not arguing whether it's morally okay for people to dress a certain way, that is a different discussion. Yes, there are people out there who dress in a way to deliberately sexually exploit themselves and others, but those people represent quite a small percentage of the population.
I'm talking about the woman with the gym pants on, the summer dress that sits above the knee, the top that shows some cleavage.
I'm not happy with the whole, women watch yourselves you may cause a man to stumble line. How about the men watch themselves, if they are stumbling best to pick your own feet up a little rather than looking to throw the blame around.

This hits close to home for me. Of all the sins I struggle against, I think lust is my biggest weakness. I don't think I'm alone on this though. For a man, every time we see a good looking woman, it's like the first time we have ever seen a woman in our lives. It's the one joy of life that never gets old.

Like you said previously, we live in a pretty perverted culture. Women have simply never looked more desirable than they do today, I believe, is thanks to advanced clothing manufacturing that allows for cheap and easy to produce materials for clothing such as yoga pants as mentioned.

I understand the women that want to wear yoga pants: they are constantly pressured by themselves and other girls to look presentable 24/7. If they want to relax, put their hair in a ponytail, wear a sweatshirt, yoga pants, and just be comfortable without caring, they 100% have the right to.

Women are the spawn of Satan. Women should not leave the house clothed in anything less than a full-length dress, and a head covering. Better yet, wear whatever you want, but stay in the kitchen.

Since the time of Adam and Eve, women just try to get men in trouble.

Signed,




PS: where's my damn sammich?!?!?

Hortator wrote:This hits close to home for me. Of all the sins I struggle against, I think lust is my biggest weakness. I don't think I'm alone on this though. For a man, every time we see a good looking woman, it's like the first time we have ever seen a woman in our lives. It's the one joy of life that never gets old.

Like you said previously, we live in a pretty perverted culture. Women have simply never looked more desirable than they do today, I believe, is thanks to advanced clothing manufacturing that allows for cheap and easy to produce materials for clothing such as yoga pants as mentioned.

I understand the women that want to wear yoga pants: they are constantly pressured by themselves and other girls to look presentable 24/7. If they want to relax, put their hair in a ponytail, wear a sweatshirt, yoga pants, and just be comfortable without caring, they 100% have the right to.

Yeah you are not alone, but I'm not with you on this one. Even though I see that a lot. I find it pathetic, tbh. Like, seriously, do you really need to turn around after every woman in yoga pants passing you by... (not addressing you personally )


I suppose I'd get more lusty if she quoted a philosopher or a poem...

IceMobster wrote:

Hortator wrote:This hits close to home for me. Of all the sins I struggle against, I think lust is my biggest weakness. I don't think I'm alone on this though. For a man, every time we see a good looking woman, it's like the first time we have ever seen a woman in our lives. It's the one joy of life that never gets old.

Like you said previously, we live in a pretty perverted culture. Women have simply never looked more desirable than they do today, I believe, is thanks to advanced clothing manufacturing that allows for cheap and easy to produce materials for clothing such as yoga pants as mentioned.

I understand the women that want to wear yoga pants: they are constantly pressured by themselves and other girls to look presentable 24/7. If they want to relax, put their hair in a ponytail, wear a sweatshirt, yoga pants, and just be comfortable without caring, they 100% have the right to.

Yeah you are not alone, but I'm not with you on this one. Even though I see that a lot. I find it pathetic, tbh. Like, seriously, do you really need to turn around after every woman in yoga pants passing you by... (not addressing you personally )


I suppose I'd get more lusty if she quoted a philosopher or a poem...

Sounds like somebody needs to get his Testosterone level checked.

RickD wrote:

IceMobster wrote:

Hortator wrote:This hits close to home for me. Of all the sins I struggle against, I think lust is my biggest weakness. I don't think I'm alone on this though. For a man, every time we see a good looking woman, it's like the first time we have ever seen a woman in our lives. It's the one joy of life that never gets old.

Like you said previously, we live in a pretty perverted culture. Women have simply never looked more desirable than they do today, I believe, is thanks to advanced clothing manufacturing that allows for cheap and easy to produce materials for clothing such as yoga pants as mentioned.

I understand the women that want to wear yoga pants: they are constantly pressured by themselves and other girls to look presentable 24/7. If they want to relax, put their hair in a ponytail, wear a sweatshirt, yoga pants, and just be comfortable without caring, they 100% have the right to.

Yeah you are not alone, but I'm not with you on this one. Even though I see that a lot. I find it pathetic, tbh. Like, seriously, do you really need to turn around after every woman in yoga pants passing you by... (not addressing you personally )


I suppose I'd get more lusty if she quoted a philosopher or a poem...

Sounds like somebody needs to get his Testosterone level checked.

I know, right? Ever since the operation, I don't feel the same:


Enjoy your sammich while watching this.

I didn't want to eat that sammich, anyways.

RickD wrote:I didn't want to eat that sammich, anyways.

Now we know what a "sammich" is.

IceMobster wrote:e:

One less thing for men to stumble over.

Thanks.. Cos we've all been having sleepless nights wondering how thats done

Well back on Mel's topic...

Mel, do men make women stumble?
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B. W. wrote:Well back on Mel's topic...

Mel, do men make women stumble?
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No. Isn't there a wise proverb that says women are the root of all evil?

For Christians, I do think we all have a responsibility towards one another. But that in no way takes away from the personal responsibility we each have for ourselves.

What we do, how we dress, what we say does impact others for good or bad and I think we need to be mindful of that. I totally agree that it's up to the individual to be accoubtable before God in whats appropriate and what is not.

I think some countries take it to an extreme with covering everything including hair BUT I think there is also a lack of modesty in general in alot of societes. It seems little by little we stretch what is deemed decent until it can take something really indecent to make us think its wrong. We can become desensitised like we can to violence.

Just my thoughts anyway.

I remember whenever our old pastors wife bent over and she knew her top would then become revealing, she would just make sure it didnt give everyone a eyeful by holding it to her chest. To me thats being modest, thoughtful and considerate. She always dressed young and pretty but there was a modesty to her as well that I think is attractive.