Evidence for God from Science

I know the word church means to assembly. Also historical early Christians meet at homes, catacombs and a few other places. So can the church also be anywhere believers get together? Lately I and I can't explain it haven’t felt right entering church buildings

UsagiTsukino wrote:I know the word church means to assembly. Also historical early Christians meet at homes, catacombs and a few other places. So can the church also be anywhere believers get together? Lately I and I can't explain it haven’t felt right entering church buildings

Yes. I believe I would consider anywhere that believers meet, would fit under the definition of church.

The key point is that you are meeting with other believers.

Well, I'm pretty sure, it's got a building with a steeple. And if that steeple doesn't have a cross up yonder - well, it's probably the home of some cult. And every Sunday morning at 11 a.m., right after Sunday School lets out, a prim and proper old lady with lots of perfectly sprayed and coiffed hair, starts jamming on a really loud organ. ACOUSTIC guitars, while frowned upon, are occasionally tolerated. There's a choir, with nice satin robes. There's usually a nice man behind a big, fancy lectern, probably wearing either a dress suit or silk garments with a big cross on it. And that's the pastor - or minister, or reverend, or whatever - and he's the "big cahuna" in most churches - "da boss!" He smiles so much it must hurt. His sermons are almost always (and miraculously) EXACTLY 25 minutes long. And if he's studied any theology at all, that boy's preaching from the biggest, fattest King James leather bible you ever saw this side of the Vatican! And he always manages to turn his most-pious use of the word "Lord" into a multi-syllable one: "the Lllawwwadd said..."

There's always an offering basket of rather generous dimensions - "primed" with some cash before it hits the first pew. And you can always tell the really faithful because they always pony up with CASH (and big bills facing outward), most theatrically and slowly stuffed into the basket ("hey, that Billy Bob's really carrying us this week!"). And you can tell the really religious attenders - they don't wear just a tie, but ALWAYS, also, a SUIT! There's lots hymns sung with many voices gloriously "strangling the cat." And if it's a modern church building, there's a big 'ol screen for the old codgers to read the words to the hymns! There's usually a big, ole' baptism pool behind the choir loft. And if they are "authentically Christian," they'd rather do a cannon ball from a high dive than this puny, little sprinkling stuff (pagans!). And the windows of the "sanctuary" should be of colorful stained glass. And the benches ("pews") are not good for those with a big stock of Preparation H in their medicine cabinet. And there is always some kind of church picnic in which every heart-killing food known to man is gluttonously prepared and reveled in, by many portly and unhealthy people (heart specialists LOVE church food!). Lots of "thee" and "thous" piously said by the pastor, who always shakes the hands of those leaving the church.

It looks like this, outside:



And like this, inside:



Big bubbles, lots of troubles!



And the longer they hold 'em down, the more sinful they must have been!

Anything I've left out of what a church should look like?

And to think some silly once told me that, "God looks ONLY at one's heart in worship." What a big dummy, eh?

Philip
You did a brilliant job of explaining the 'church'. The 25-minute service and the big KJV Bible -- what about the note taking? The Preparation H -- did you look in my purse. But you Also left out the Pastoral Prayer.
I Did grow up with most of that. But what made a Big positive impression were the long, but heart-felt pastoral prayers. That was Real Prayer. And Bible study/prayer meeting times -- people would share prayer requests and then get into small groups to really pray for those requests. Possibly our churches /body of believers/have lost some of our power because we're not in God's Word enough --not only in church , but on our own. And do we Pray like we need to. Do we acknowledge God as Almighty God? What is our attitude Towards God.

Is that picture of a the girl being baptized face down? We baptize lowering back --the person looking Up.

Some 'do church' as a weekly thing just because. And other take it very seriously.

RickD wrote:

UsagiTsukino wrote:I know the word church means to assembly. Also historical early Christians meet at homes, catacombs and a few other places. So can the church also be anywhere believers get together? Lately I and I can't explain it haven’t felt right entering church buildings

Yes. I believe I would consider anywhere that believers meet, would fit under the definition of church.

The key point is that you are meeting with other believers.

yes, the importance of meeting with other believers on a regular, Frequent basis. We all need spiritual encouragement.

Crochet, the reality is, I have definitely experienced all I wrote about. But it was meant as a fun satire, a bit of a parody, as like Rick alluded to, "church" can look like a lot of different things. It can be three friends meeting in a coffee shop to fellowship and share or study God's word. All that I wrote about - well, sure, sincere Christian worship and mutually/spiritually rewarding experiences can and do come from those, but they can also simply be a meaningless facade in which people are "doing" or "playing church." And your church, my church, or another's church may look and function nothing like the iconic people, places and activities I paid homage to. So, of course, the trappings don't matter one bit - it's simply two or more believers gathered in praise, worship and contemplation of God - wherever and however that might look. We know that God doesn't care how things LOOK on the outside - He only cares about what is going on inside of our hearts, and minds, in our faith and worship. But oh how so many care about the LOOK of things external, eh?

Sometimes 'a church' represents where a person is encouraged to go to 'find God' / to 'feel better' / to find 'the answer' to whatever is bothering them. Which is all fine and good. But how many times have people gone 'in' and 'left' feeling the same way -- they were Expecting to have 'something' happen while in that particular church and they leave disappointed. Because they Don't feel any better. They become disillusioned about the role / purpose of 'a church'.

Philip -- I realized what you meant it to be -- and it Was Fun. And 'a church' has such a variety of meanings depending on who's being asked. And it's very thought-provoking.
Some years ago we were at a church, post-split , and in the process of starting over -- an interim pastor was there to help us regroup -- the people had a Good opportunity to become more community-oriented -- it was a tiny Baptist church trying to survive in a Catholic community. The thought had been change it's name to something a Catholic could visit without going to a Baptist church. But NOPE -- One person put her foot down and said it was Founded as a FBC and it would STAY that way. The 'thing' was that That family didn't even live in that community. That church serves a few families in town. And Another pastor recently left. I guess it's serving a purpose.
A thought -- sometimes people feel that as long as people are attending 'a church' that they are okay. It's those who aren't associated with one that a pastor or visitation group will visit with hopes of getting Those people into their church. Apparently the thought is that as long as a person is going to some church, they are okay.

UsagiTsukino wrote:I know the word church means to assembly. Also historical early Christians meet at homes, catacombs and a few other places. So can the church also be anywhere believers get together? Lately I and I can't explain it haven’t felt right entering church buildings

Yes of course it can. In fact the early church was made up entirely of this kind of meeting of believers.
There were no church buildings but fellowship.
I have had much to do with Religion and it doesn't sit with me.
There are many Christians who strongly identify as believers but openly reject the religious, indoctrination of Christianity. Who believe in Jesus passionately but strongly feel a calling out from the church.
It's okay
Your not alone, infact there are thousands of us.
We have no ill feeling towards the IC but welcome forward, open honest conversation. Without judgment or condemnation.
I may not agree with you but I'll stand by your right to disagree

You said 'IC' -- What IS it?

Institutional Church?

So -- I.C. = the church being seen as strictly an 'institution ' / a person going through Ritual rather than a place of worship / learning. There probably IS a lot of That taking place.
A church Should be a place to 'meet with God' -- along with other believers who are there for the same reason. And sharing Scripture -- learning from each other. In an organized manner. And the pastor of the group should be discipling believers in how to lead someone to the Lord. There should be Growth in people spiritually. We should be continuing to grow in knowledge of God's Word.

Any other definitions of IC?

What Jesus said in Matthew 18:20 says pretty much what a church is...

So this is the First Church of the Evidence for God from Science a non-denominational group who meets everyday to fill in the gaps in theory...
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And where those two or three people are gathered together There will be a desire to reach out to the given community with the Gospel and then follow some guidelines regarding behavior in the church body.

So - you're suggesting that this Forum Could qualify as a non-denominational 'church'. With the moderators being the church leaders? But there are no church ordinances being practiced by the 'congregation' . And so far I've noticed that there are three moderators. An interesting concept, though. It really needs to be a Local congregation and 'this' is very spread out

I have always considered this forum as a kind of church for me.

We discuss Scripture, discuss what God and faith means to us all, encourage each other, praise God together, pray for each other...

If not a church, then a good place to test and strengthen faith.