Philip wrote:I wonder if Ice is familiar with the prophecies concerning Jesus? Does he realize that the prophecies are VERY, collectively specific. Not only could NOT just anyone show up in history and credibly claim to fulfill them - and, btw, this by JUST BEING BORN, at JUST the right, specific time, with the right lineage, from the right place (statistically EXTREMELY difficult), and be widely renowned for what they claimed He would miraculously do (here's a few:
http://www.messiahrevealed.org/miracles.html). AND THEN, He's widely believed by many that they saw Him AFTER his death! Then, please explain why his remaining disciples (after Judas suicide) ALL kept preaching a resurrected Christ that would and DID endanger them to potentially received the very same horrible punishments, UNLESS, they had actually seen the Resurrected Christ???!!! Because they KNEW the truth of that. What could possibly have been their motive - were they all lunatics who invited death? WHAT???!!!
Well Phil, truth does not matter to critics who use a form of equivalency argument to support criticism. Look at the main premise again Ice uses:
IceMobster wrote:Why use an imperfect tool to write the Scripture which could (and did) result in countless interpretations, out of the blue connections and all 3 of the main Christian denominations do not even have the same Scriptural cannon.
So, yeah, we have 1 group claiming this (choose a book from the Bible) is the inspired book -- literal Word of God!! The 2nd group says a few books should be added because, after long contemplation and by fitting their views (like 2 and 3 Mac), they realized it is also inspired. The 3rd group also adds some books and removes some others.... Annnnnnnd then here comes, idk, you name it, Quran? Muslims claim that is the inspired book! Literal Word of God (and so on you can go with any holy book)
God having foreseen this (omniscience), why did He not choose otherwise? Make a book which will not result in 71256315 Churches?
Why use an imperfect too write ... is the main crux of the argument posed? Therefore, to be true then this must be applied to all writing human beings do.
For example, in philosophy you have Aristotelian, Platonic, Materialist, Existentialist, Nihilist, Rationalism, Idealism, Positivism, Stoicism, Structuralism and the list goes on and on
See this Link for on schools of philosophic thought.
So you have one group claims it is right in its beholding of truth and another does the same, so how can philosophy be valid and hold any truth at all?
Therefore, anywhere man write his ideas, say in science or higher mathematics, you branch out in different schools of thought denominations and therefore none can be trusted because human beings write. Even what Ice writes, cannot be valid either - why - Ice, a human being, wrote an opposing view.
The actual premise he uses is that there is no truth, as it cannot exist, because human beings are human beings who have multi-ideas and concepts.
Basically his premise states that mankind cannot be trusted. Isn't that an aspect of sin?
If humanity cannot be trusted, then why would God want un-trustworthy people to live next door with?
Therefore, Ice's premise simply proves human sin nature is true and that humanity cannot save itself by any due to not knowing the way of truth.
Biblical Christianity, unlike all the world's religions, teaches that it is only by God's own hands can human beings can be turned away from error because their own works are all corrupt. Other religions systems all teach that one can work to earn, or control the right to enter heaven.
How can that be when...as Ice stated -
Why use an imperfect to write... to do anything for that matter and goes on about differing religions but neglects philosophic, all scientific, and mathematical schools of thought that cannot all agree either?
Therefore, Ice inadvertently proves human sin nature and solidifies the that the uniqueness of the biblical message that man cannot save himself because he is corrupt and that only God himself can save is true. Thus, the very uniqueness of the message that goes against the grain of all human ideology indicates a road, an arrow, pointing the true way to heaven and the cure needed to enter.
Of this cure, humanity needs to be awakened to the need to be cured, the truth, that the human heart is utterly corrupt and twisted if left to its own devises. This cure came by the uniqueness of the message of the cross that God came as a human being to 1- expose the real hidden sin of the human heart, and 2 - pay the penalty for it.
Before the cross Jesus exposed what human beings’ do to utter goodness. How humanity doubts, test, provoke goodness to act contrary to goodness. This is aptly shown in the events just before Jesus was arrested as well as afterwards, as the events exposes the true nature of sin in the heart in us all by an unforgettable act of savagery against all goodness (God himself come as a man:
Expose how we human beings betray, sell each other out, abandon, reject, put on trial (in the mind), bear false witnesses, hold grudges, mock, beat, make others carry a heavy load they cannot carry, steal, form alliances to silence opposition, whip, spit upon i.e. hold others in contempt, selfish pride, and how human beings glory in the crucifying of goodness in exchange for letting rebellion and depravity go...free.
All this proves that human beings cannot save themselves in any shape or form due to this: how can they be trusted because they twist way of truth to suite their own ends? Therefore, just as the bible proves, humanity needs a savior, God himself to release humanity from this shame because all are incapable of seeing the twistedness of each, their own heart, unless seen by a barbaric act that transcends time, era, and cultures - the cross.
All Ices' premise does is simply prove that the way of atheism and other world religions that truth cannot be known. The fact that atheism seeks to murder the knowledge of the one sent to rescue them, expunge it proves the depravity of the human condition hiding behind self-righteous idealism.
The good news that Jesus came to expose the human condition and die in our place for it so we can awake to God’s one way back to Heaven: Jesus Christ. God made it so simple, trust, have faith in him because his act proves God's love and goodness true. Simple faith in Jesus alone is what saves and changes us out of our darkness exposed by the cross into new light of light. By this, his act alone, can one enter heaven as it does not rely on human merit at all - all contrary to all world's religions - so truth established.
How to return to God? See your heart and that you cannot change. Go before God in prayer and call upon the Name of the Lord - Jesus Christ to become saved just as it mentions in Luke 18:13, John 3:16-21, Eph 2:8,9 Romans 10:8-13
It is that simple; Just ask... trust in what he has done because ...Why use an imperfect too ... save?
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