Evidence for God from Science

If you are interested, here are about 670,000 posts to read -> http://whywontgodhealamputees.com/forums/index.php

I've read about a few examples over the years, e.g. the holy spirit's ability to create live matter (to restore shortened limbs to their proper length, etc..)

There is not much of this in the bible though. Has anyone got a good story or two on the subject ?

Big Hamster: I've read about a few examples over the years, e.g. the holy spirit's ability to create live matter (to restore shortened limbs to their proper length, etc.

Of course, a God Who can speak a universe into existence, Who can raise the dead, can heal a limb. Jesus caused people born lame to walk, instantly healed the ear of the servant Peter cut off with a sword. The Apostles, conveying further inspired teachings from the Lord, had the ability to heal in such ways. But these gifts went away, as no further Apostles existed, nor any new Scripture being given. This is how we know that those insisting healing gifts exist today - as where is the proof? If anyone had such a GIFT, today, they would be world famous, with desperately sick people following them wherever they might go. But as for God Himself, He still heals, and obviously still has the ability to - even though such immediate miracles appear to be be far more rare, or done over a period of time, or are not so immediately obvious, as in the regrowing of a limb, etc. The miracles of Christ and His Apostles had such abilities, during a very specific time, to draw attention to the spiritual points inherent in their teachings.

This may or may not be what you are looking for, but here is one of my favorite quotes from Augustine.

When good and bad men suffer alike, they are not, for that reason indistinguishable because what they suffer is similar.
The sufferers are different even though the sufferings are the same trials; though what they endure is the same, their virtue and vice are different.
For, in the same fire, gold gleams and straw smokes; under the same flail the stalk is crushed and the grain threshed; the lees are not mistaken for oil because they have issued from the same press.
So, too, the tide of trouble will test, purify, and improve the good, but beat, crush, and wash away the wicked.
So it is that, under the weight of the same affliction, the wicked deny and blaspheme God, and the good pray to Him and praise Him.
The difference is not in what people suffer but in the way they suffer.
The same shaking that makes fetid water stink makes perfume issue a more pleasant odor.

Clones. A scientist could clone an amputee. Grow the clone in a lab. Cut the arm off the clone. Attach the arm. Euthanatize the clone.

Bethany Hamilton could have her arm back.

BigHamster wrote:If you are interested, here are about 670,000 posts to read -> http://whywontgodhealamputees.com/forums/index.php

I've read about a few examples over the years, e.g. the holy spirit's ability to create live matter (to restore shortened limbs to their proper length, etc..)

There is not much of this in the bible though. Has anyone got a good story or two on the subject ?

When I was 13, I got into a bicycling accident. I was going around a corner, and I slipped on some leaves. My hand was bleeding, and I noticed that I lost the fingernail on my left index finger.

It "miraculously" grew back. Does that count?

RickD wrote:

BigHamster wrote:If you are interested, here are about 670,000 posts to read -> http://whywontgodhealamputees.com/forums/index.php

I've read about a few examples over the years, e.g. the holy spirit's ability to create live matter (to restore shortened limbs to their proper length, etc..)

There is not much of this in the bible though. Has anyone got a good story or two on the subject ?

When I was 13, I got into a bicycling accident. I was going around a corner, and I slipped on some leaves. My hand was bleeding, and I noticed that I lost the fingernail on my left index finger.

It "miraculously" grew back. Does that count?

Sure does. I got a small cut on my hand years ago....now completely healed too. People aren't aware that its the Holy Spirit that builds and maintains all bodily organs and their functioning including repairs. The chemistry/physics that go on are consequential. I could go on and talk about mystical concepts but sacramento might pipe up with his warnings.

BigHamster wrote:

RickD wrote:

BigHamster wrote:If you are interested, here are about 670,000 posts to read -> http://whywontgodhealamputees.com/forums/index.php

I've read about a few examples over the years, e.g. the holy spirit's ability to create live matter (to restore shortened limbs to their proper length, etc..)

There is not much of this in the bible though. Has anyone got a good story or two on the subject ?

When I was 13, I got into a bicycling accident. I was going around a corner, and I slipped on some leaves. My hand was bleeding, and I noticed that I lost the fingernail on my left index finger.

It "miraculously" grew back. Does that count?

Sure does. I got a small cut on my hand years ago....now completely healed too. People aren't aware that its the Holy Spirit that builds and maintains all bodily organs and their functioning including repairs. The chemistry/physics that go on are consequential. I could go on and talk about mystical concepts but sacramento might pipe up with his warnings.

I hadn't really though about this before, and it's kinda amazing. Made me think of another one:
I cut my hair a couple of weeks ago, and wouldn't you know...IT GREW BACK!!

RickD wrote:

BigHamster wrote:

RickD wrote:

BigHamster wrote:If you are interested, here are about 670,000 posts to read -> http://whywontgodhealamputees.com/forums/index.php

I've read about a few examples over the years, e.g. the holy spirit's ability to create live matter (to restore shortened limbs to their proper length, etc..)

There is not much of this in the bible though. Has anyone got a good story or two on the subject ?

When I was 13, I got into a bicycling accident. I was going around a corner, and I slipped on some leaves. My hand was bleeding, and I noticed that I lost the fingernail on my left index finger.

It "miraculously" grew back. Does that count?

Sure does. I got a small cut on my hand years ago....now completely healed too. People aren't aware that its the Holy Spirit that builds and maintains all bodily organs and their functioning including repairs. The chemistry/physics that go on are consequential. I could go on and talk about mystical concepts but sacramento might pipe up with his warnings.

I hadn't really though about this before, and it's kinda amazing. Made me think of another one:
I cut my hair a couple of weeks ago, and wouldn't you know...IT GREW BACK!!

Now the big question. If the Holy Spirit heals cuts and bruises, why don't it heal missing limbs ?

What sort of healing vending machine is that !

BigHamster wrote:

RickD wrote:

BigHamster wrote:

RickD wrote:

BigHamster wrote:If you are interested, here are about 670,000 posts to read -> http://whywontgodhealamputees.com/forums/index.php

I've read about a few examples over the years, e.g. the holy spirit's ability to create live matter (to restore shortened limbs to their proper length, etc..)

There is not much of this in the bible though. Has anyone got a good story or two on the subject ?

When I was 13, I got into a bicycling accident. I was going around a corner, and I slipped on some leaves. My hand was bleeding, and I noticed that I lost the fingernail on my left index finger.

It "miraculously" grew back. Does that count?

Sure does. I got a small cut on my hand years ago....now completely healed too. People aren't aware that its the Holy Spirit that builds and maintains all bodily organs and their functioning including repairs. The chemistry/physics that go on are consequential. I could go on and talk about mystical concepts but sacramento might pipe up with his warnings.

I hadn't really though about this before, and it's kinda amazing. Made me think of another one:
I cut my hair a couple of weeks ago, and wouldn't you know...IT GREW BACK!!

Now the big question. If the Holy Spirit heals cuts and bruises, why don't it heal missing limbs ?

What sort of healing vending machine is that !

Now you're freaking me out. You're starting to remind me of Benny Hinn.

ROFL !









....thread deterioration detector beeping

Jesus makes arm grow .....

BigHamster wrote:Jesus makes arm grow .....

I wouldn't have believed it if I hadn't seen it with my own eyes!

Even the kiwis have miracles!

There are many points I believe, which if you add together, provide a powerful case for why God doesn't (or rarely) intervenes in the world He created us within. Why God allows suffering. Why God tolerates bad things happening. Why God doesn't intervene to stop evil being commited against somone else. Why God doesn't routinely heal us.

It is difficult to structure all these thoughts, but if you add them all together they provide an accumulative understanding. Whether or not some or all are satisfactory to a person, well each of us decides for ourselves. BUT, when I question "why God" allows this or that, and have gotten upset with God and His apparent lack of intervention to stop evil, many thoughts like this I've reflected upon.

1)

• God desires creatures who are largely free to accept or deny Him.
• God created a stable and temporary world for this purpose, to test the hearts of human beings towards Himself.
• God's constant intervention is contrary to a stable world.
• God's constant intervention thwarts testing the hearts of human beings towards Himself (since who could then freely and largely reject an obtrusive God if we can't bury His existence?).

2)

• God is love.
• True love between God and a human requires the freedom of that human to either accept or reject God.
• True freedom to accept or reject is only had where both can be truly enacted upon.
• Only where someone accepts God, and God accepts that someone, can love truly exist between both parties.
• Without a world that gives us a choice to freely accept or reject God, love between us and God only remains a potentiality.

3)

• God is good.
• To go against God (good) necessarily results in evil.
• Due to God's love, he tolerates evil so that some might accept Him, and love can be had between us and Himself (#2 above)
• Those who reject God, going against what is good, is tolerated by God in order to allow true love to be had.
• Evil is therefore tolerated for a time until the full number He desires comes in.

4)

• God is omniscient.
• God knows all who would accept Him and could create just those people.
• If God created just those people, then the choise of those who accepted God would only be a potentiality rather than actuality.
• This leads to the contradiction that such people didn't actually choose God, but God is only creating people according to Himself (foreknowledge of what would be potentially the case). Without having actually chosen God, such people were not free to choose God, and therefore true love cannot be had.
• Thus, God must create humans in a world with the potentiality to actually choose Him rather than upon his foreknowledge of what they'd do where their choosing Him doesn't actually happen.

5)

• God is omnipotent, which entails He can do all that which is logically possible (logical impossibilities aren't "things" but "nothings", and as CS Lewis articulated, God is a God of sense not nonsense).
• God could stop evil in the world, but this would logically thwart points in #1, #2 and #3 above.
• God MUST at some point stop evil, but so long as our world serves His purpose (#1 above) then He will tolerate and allow evil to be had for many reasons stated above -- evil is ultimately due to a rejection of God who is the source of all good.
• God could heal amputees (and will restore us some day), but to do so immediately in this world would infringe upon God's main imperative for this temporary world and life that we live within it.

RickD wrote:

BigHamster wrote:Jesus makes arm grow .....

I wouldn't have believed it if I hadn't seen it with my own eyes!

It looks like "Jesus" just reversed which arm was longer than the other. The shorter arm looked slightly longer. Amazing stuff though. Most definitely would turn any skeptic who watched into a believer. Please Ed, Kenny, you got to watch it!