Evidence for God from Science

I pray that God will use his divine intervention to protect Christianity from its desecration by so many of its members worshiping the abomination who may not be the anti-Christ but will do until the real thing comes around.

To borrow a quote from the Boss in concert about Clarence Clemons, "Do I have to say his name?"

Ultimate, I'm sure I speak for many here, but you need to give the politics a rest - as it seems that's the only thing you are here for!

ultimate777 wrote:I pray that God will use his divine intervention to protect Christianity from its desecration by so many of its members worshiping the abomination who may not be the anti-Christ but will do until the real thing comes around.

To borrow a quote from the Boss in concert about Clarence Clemons, "Do I have to say his name?"

If you're going to imply that Trump may be the anti-christ like false prophets have said about every President since Bill Clinton then you need to give scripture reasons why you think he could be the anti-christ.I'm a big Trump supporter but even I have considered him being the anti-christ and it simply won't line up with scripture to try to claim Trump is the anti-christ.First off the anti-christ will have no regard for women and Trump is married.The anti-christ will probably be single or homosexual or just not desire women.

Philip wrote:Ultimate, I'm sure I speak for many here, but you need to give the politics a rest - as it seems that's the only thing you are here for!

Philip,

You certainly don't speak for me. I enjoy Ultimate's unhealthy obsession with Trump, and his seemingly endless rants.

I can't speak for anyone else, but I've learned more from ultimate's ignorant ranting threads, than any other threads on this forum.

No seriously, where would we be without these enlightening threads?

Philip,

You certainly don't speak for me. I enjoy Ultimate's unhealthy obsession with Trump, and his seemingly endless rants.

I can't speak for anyone else, but I've learned more from ultimate's ignorant ranting threads, than any other threads on this forum.

No seriously, where would we be without these enlightening threads?

Kind of like learning from some people how to appreciate and best interact with women.

Almost.

But addressing the OP...

For the life of me, I cannot understand how any American who calls himself a Christian, could complain about Trump being president. Look at what the alternative would've been, and tell me, as a Christian, how THAT could've been better.

I can understand leftists complaining endlessly about Trump. But someone who claims to be Christian?


Maybe some people think we live in a perfect world, where there's always a perfect choice, or a perfect candidate. But that's just not reality.

RickD wrote: I can understand leftists complaining endlessly about Trump. But someone who claims to be Christian?

If Christians do not speak out against...
Immoral behavior, repeated lies, corruption, and criminal behavior when the leader in question is a 'Republican', then Christians sacrifice their testimony regarding moral behavior... especially when they repeatedly chastise 'Democrats' for behavior that they turn a blind eye to in 'Republicans'.

There is a word for that type of behavior... hypocrisy.

I understand and have some level of sympathy for the 'lesser of two evils' argument.

However, I do not understand elements of the evangelical community who full heartedly supported an immoral lying criminal. I think the evangelical community damaged their reputation and testimony when they became apologists for immoral criminal behavior in 2016.

DBowling wrote:

RickD wrote: I can understand leftists complaining endlessly about Trump. But someone who claims to be Christian?

If Christians do not speak out against...
Immoral behavior, repeated lies, corruption, and criminal behavior when the leader in question is a 'Republican', then Christians sacrifice their testimony regarding moral behavior... especially when they repeatedly chastise 'Democrats' for behavior that they turn a blind eye to in 'Republicans'.

There is a word for that type of behavior... hypocrisy.

I understand and have some level of sympathy for the 'lesser of two evils' argument.

However, I do not understand elements of the evangelical community who full heartedly supported an immoral lying criminal. I think the evangelical community damaged their reputation and testimony when they became apologists for immoral criminal behavior in 2016.

Of course there's a difference between voting for someone, and being a Trump rump swab.

In WWII, did the US full heartedly support Stalin, just because they chose to work with him, over Hitler?

Trump, and nobody for that matter, is a perfect human being. We vote for, and support the person we believe is best for the job. If we continually wait for the perfect candidate, and don't go with the lesser of two evils, we will always be taking two steps back.

After one year of Trump in office, you still don't think he's doing a good job?

RickD wrote: After one year of Trump in office, you still don't think he's doing a good job?

Let me split your question into two separate questions:

1. Is Trump a good President?
No, I do not believe Trump is a good President.
Aside from being an immoral lying criminal, Trumps public behavior as an erratic man-child is bad for the Country and the World. I would feel much better if a moral, competent, and stable person like Pence were President.

2. Has Trump done some good things as President?
Absolutely...
I believe Gorsuch was a great Supreme Court pick.
I'm glad the Republicans finally got Tax Reform passed. I think the reality of 2018 will show that contrary to the assertions of some, the tax bill is good for everyone.
I've also complimented many of the people that Trump has surrounded himself with. I thank God for the stability that Pence, Kelly, and Tillerson bring to the White House.

DB:
2. Has Trump done some good things as President?
Absolutely...
I believe Gorsuch was a great Supreme Court pick.
I'm glad the Republicans finally got Tax Reform passed. I think the reality of 2018 will show that contrary to the assertions of some, the tax bill is good for everyone.
I've also complimented many of the people that Trump has surrounded himself with. I thank God for the stability that Pence, Kelly, and Tillerson bring to the White House.

And so I think you have touched on some things that make me think that Trump, while certainly a mixed bag, personally - he's certainly no saint, is often ridiculous - that overall, nonetheless, we are still FAR better off than if the Clinton Gang had gotten back into to office - certainly economically, likely militarily, with appointed judges, Supreme Court picks, etc. Yes, Hillary and Billy Bob are THAT bad, and THAT corrupt - and the people they would have surrounded themselves with would have just taken us further down a very bad road. And so, if you're stranded in the desert, can't walk out, and you stumble upon the only two horses you must choose between, then that's what you sometimes have to do. It's what I did. Doesn't mean I like it - absolutely hated the choices, and there were candidates far better than Trump. But the one thing HE did that the other candidates wouldn't/couldn't do, is really call the Democrats on their policies and past actions. He said things no one else would have. Any of the other Republicans probably would have been defeated. As I look back, my choice of Trump still seems considerably better, even though he is immensely flawed. And if he does something stupid, there are excellent people in power and place to step in.

One thing is for sure, we should ALL be praying for Trump and Co. - that he and they will mature, seek God's wisdom, and learn to be guided by it. ONLY fools want to see Trump self-destruct and make things worse for our country. The Clintons did so many dirty deals it's unreal. Obama and co over the Iran deal - unbelievably stupid! And he and Hil sure screwed up Libya. That ANY woman would have voted for Hillary is unreal - she's complacent in covering up Bubba's whoring and worse. And that's not to say Trump has clean hands in his past either. But nuances matter, and one has to deal with reality as it is, not as they wish it to be. Hopefully, smart conservatives will have learned at least one thing from Trump: Be bold! Quite trying to be loved by everyone with PC talk and attempting to pander to everyone across the political spectrum. Do what is right. Take some risks. Call out politicians in both parties that screw up, have terrible ideas, etc.

ultimate777 wrote:I pray that God will use his divine intervention to protect Christianity from its desecration by so many of its members worshiping the abomination who may not be the anti-Christ but will do until the real thing comes around.

To borrow a quote from the Boss in concert about Clarence Clemons, "Do I have to say his name?"

Forgive me for taking your statement literally. But again, you've left me confused.

If anyone worships anyone other than Christ, then they're not Christian.

abelcainsbrother wrote:

ultimate777 wrote:I pray that God will use his divine intervention to protect Christianity from its desecration by so many of its members worshiping the abomination who may not be the anti-Christ but will do until the real thing comes around.

To borrow a quote from the Boss in concert about Clarence Clemons, "Do I have to say his name?"

If you're going to imply that Trump may be the anti-christ like false prophets have said about every President since Bill Clinton then you need to give scripture reasons why you think he could be the anti-christ.I'm a big Trump supporter but even I have considered him being the anti-christ and it simply won't line up with scripture to try to claim Trump is the anti-christ.First off the anti-christ will have no regard for women and Trump is married.The anti-christ will probably be single or homosexual or just not desire women.

He's not the anti-Christ, just the closest thing to him around.

RickD wrote:

Philip wrote:Ultimate, I'm sure I speak for many here, but you need to give the politics a rest - as it seems that's the only thing you are here for!

Philip,

You certainly don't speak for me. I enjoy Ultimate's unhealthy obsession with Trump, and his seemingly endless rants.

I can't speak for anyone else, but I've learned more from ultimate's ignorant ranting threads, than any other threads on this forum.

No seriously, where would we be without these enlightening threads?

I pity you.

DBowling wrote:

RickD wrote: I can understand leftists complaining endlessly about Trump. But someone who claims to be Christian?

If Christians do not speak out against...
Immoral behavior, repeated lies, corruption, and criminal behavior when the leader in question is a 'Republican', then Christians sacrifice their testimony regarding moral behavior... especially when they repeatedly chastise 'Democrats' for behavior that they turn a blind eye to in 'Republicans'.

There is a word for that type of behavior... hypocrisy.

I understand and have some level of sympathy for the 'lesser of two evils' argument.

However, I do not understand elements of the evangelical community who full heartedly supported an immoral lying criminal. I think the evangelical community damaged their reputation and testimony when they became apologists for immoral criminal behavior in 2016.

You have it exactly right.

RickD wrote:

DBowling wrote:

RickD wrote: I can understand leftists complaining endlessly about Trump. But someone who claims to be Christian?

If Christians do not speak out against...
Immoral behavior, repeated lies, corruption, and criminal behavior when the leader in question is a 'Republican', then Christians sacrifice their testimony regarding moral behavior... especially when they repeatedly chastise 'Democrats' for behavior that they turn a blind eye to in 'Republicans'.

There is a word for that type of behavior... hypocrisy.

I understand and have some level of sympathy for the 'lesser of two evils' argument.

However, I do not understand elements of the evangelical community who full heartedly supported an immoral lying criminal. I think the evangelical community damaged their reputation and testimony when they became apologists for immoral criminal behavior in 2016.

Of course there's a difference between voting for someone, and being a Trump rump swab.

In WWII, did the US full heartedly support Stalin, just because they chose to work with him, over Hitler?

Trump, and nobody for that matter, is a perfect human being. We vote for, and support the person we believe is best for the job. If we continually wait for the perfect candidate, and don't go with the lesser of two evils, we will always be taking two steps back.

After one year of Trump in office, you still don't think he's doing a good job?

You know he isn't.