Evidence for God from Science

So what do you guys know about the Covid vaccines.

Are they RNA based?
Do they alter your DNA at all?

I don't think any will be the actual mark of the beast, as the Bible says you will know that you are taking it and will have to do so willingly, so more than likely will know that you are worshipping the image of the beast, but they could be doing a trial run for another event, like another deadly disease that is much worse than Covid that kills many more people. And so many will take the mark as they will be scared of dying and will do so willingly even though that means worshipping the image of the beast.

Some say that the mark will alter your DNA. There is plenty speculation that the mark will include a vaccine and it could be (well, no it would be) a trojan horse as the Bible says that boils form on the skin of those who take the mark and worship the beast. Now the boils could be a result of the mark itself, but we do know that it signifies those who took the mark and those who worship the beast's image.

REVELATION 16:2
And the first went and poured out his vial upon the earth; and there fell a noisome and grievous sore upon the men who had the mark of the beast and upon them that worshipped his image.

Stu, all that stuff is speculation! But anyone worshiping ANY anti-Christ will willingly do so.

Course, you've read through this link and DB's links noted at the end: viewtopic.php?f=13&t=42998&p=244240&hil ... ac#p244240

Yeah, anyway just a heads up for those that think a mark is bunkum, and then one day an actual physical mark rears it's head....

I happen to care about my health and the health of those around me (which is why I 'mask up' when I go out in public), so I will most definitely get the Covid-19 vaccine as soon as it becomes available to me... which will probably be sometime early next year.

As for the Mark of the Beast...
I have been saved by grace through faith, not by any work that I may or may not perform.
And when I put my faith and trust in Jesus, he gave me the 'Mark of the Lamb'.

I think it is much better to place my faith in Jesus Christ instead of pseudo-scriptural prophetic theories.

DB: I think it is much better to place my faith in Jesus Christ instead of pseudo-scriptural prophetic theories.

I think about this a lot when I see people obsessed with endtimes stuff. It's almost as if they are terrified that if they don't understand it correctly or don't do this or that at the right time, then they are doomed or in great peril. But there are a number of views held by some really smart people - that they don't agree should tell us something. Just as those pre-Christ's birth thought they correctly understood the thrust of the Messianic prophecies, well, in the same way, I can guarantee you that there is much we don't yet know and can't CURRENTLY understand about the various endtimes prophecies because we don't yet have key information - which will come at the proper time and as God desires it. We must trust God to guide us in whatever events unfold in our lifetimes - as opposed to thinking we've got to have a perfect theological understanding to get through whatever/whenever. Trusting that our own understandings aren't flawed is NOT trusting in God, but in self.

DBowling wrote: ↑Wed Dec 02, 2020 12:47 pm I happen to care about my health and the health of those around me (which is why I 'mask up' when I go out in public), so I will most definitely get the Covid-19 vaccine as soon as it becomes available to me... which will probably be sometime early next year.

As for the Mark of the Beast...
I have been saved by grace through faith, not by any work that I may or may not perform.
And when I put my faith and trust in Jesus, he gave me the 'Mark of the Lamb'.

I think it is much better to place my faith in Jesus Christ instead of pseudo-scriptural prophetic theories.

Better yet, if you have faith, you still have common sense. Trusting in God that he will save you from disease is wonderful, you can trust in God that he will save you from cancer or psoriasis, but if we talk about infectious diseases, then it’s better to rely on the judgments of infectious disease scientists and rely on on their conclusions on the rules for the prevention of certain diseases.

Challenger007: Better yet, if you have faith, you still have common sense.

Absolutely! In fact, this is the counsel of the Bible, to use good judgment as well.

DBowling wrote:
I happen to care about my health and the health of those around me (which is why I 'mask up' when I go out in public), so I will most definitely get the Covid-19 vaccine as soon as it becomes available to me... which will probably be sometime early next year.

Sure. The government guarantees the safety of multiple, rushed vaccines. What could possibly go wrong? The survival rate of Covid 19 is well over 99 percent. We know this is a fact. What’s the long term effects of a new, unproven vaccine?

Keep drinking the govt propaganda Kool Aid. The Covid vaccines are sure to be safe and effective against a virus that virtually all healthy people recover from.

DBowling,

You said that you care about your health. So I’m going to assume that you are healthy with no underlying conditions? Skip the untested vaccine. Healthy people have healthy immune systems that fight off viruses.

RickD wrote: ↑Thu Dec 03, 2020 8:02 pm

DBowling wrote:
I happen to care about my health and the health of those around me (which is why I 'mask up' when I go out in public), so I will most definitely get the Covid-19 vaccine as soon as it becomes available to me... which will probably be sometime early next year.

Sure. The government guarantees the safety of multiple, rushed vaccines. What could possibly go wrong? The survival rate of Covid 19 is well over 99 percent. We know this is a fact. What’s the long term effects of a new, unproven vaccine?

Keep drinking the govt propaganda Kool Aid. The Covid vaccines are sure to be safe and effective against a virus that virtually all healthy people recover from.

DBowling,

You said that you care about your health. So I’m going to assume that you are healthy with no underlying conditions? Skip the untested vaccine. Healthy people have healthy immune systems that fight off viruses.

Healthy people have died from covid and have unknowingly been carriers to those who do have underlying conditions. I will continue to listen to the advice of medical professionals who are actually experts in epidemics instead of the charlatans that some have been getting their misinformation from.

So yes, for the sake of myself and those I love, I will take the vaccine as soon as it becomes available.

Would it make a difference if I told you that virtually every nurse in my hospital will refuse the vaccine?
You wouldn’t wonder why RNs will refuse the vaccine?

DBowling wrote: ↑Thu Dec 03, 2020 9:00 pm

RickD wrote: ↑Thu Dec 03, 2020 8:02 pm

DBowling wrote:
I happen to care about my health and the health of those around me (which is why I 'mask up' when I go out in public), so I will most definitely get the Covid-19 vaccine as soon as it becomes available to me... which will probably be sometime early next year.

Sure. The government guarantees the safety of multiple, rushed vaccines. What could possibly go wrong? The survival rate of Covid 19 is well over 99 percent. We know this is a fact. What’s the long term effects of a new, unproven vaccine?

Keep drinking the govt propaganda Kool Aid. The Covid vaccines are sure to be safe and effective against a virus that virtually all healthy people recover from.

DBowling,

You said that you care about your health. So I’m going to assume that you are healthy with no underlying conditions? Skip the untested vaccine. Healthy people have healthy immune systems that fight off viruses.

Healthy people have died from covid and have unknowingly been carriers to those who do have underlying conditions. I will continue to listen to the advice of medical professionals who are actually experts in epidemics instead of the charlatans that some have been getting their misinformation from.

So yes, for the sake of myself and those I love, I will take the vaccine as soon as it becomes available.

What's your definition of "healthy"?

Having no fat or even going to gym every day and looking buff does not equal healthy.

Being healthy means eating the right foods so that your immune system is in tip top shape, THAT is what fights viruses.
Strange that the immune system is hardly ever mentioned by the mainstream media.

I watched a CNN interview with 3 so called experts and they were all asked what the average person can do to help fight or prevent getting Covid. NONE of them said eat healthier to improve your immune system. They all said I don't know, just stay home, etc. I was flabbergasted.

It's like prescribing healthy eating as a tool for fighting disease has become persona non grata among some people, almost like it's what they done in the past before medication, and is almost akin to pseudo-medicine. It's ridiculous.

That's complete nonsense, we are all exposed to many different things all the time and the only reason we don't fall over and die is because of our immune system, you eat healthy you are more likely to fight those things off. Just look at AIDS, that should have been a wake up call for everyone but instead no one came away with the huge lesson.

Look at America, they eat so unhealthy and then everyone wonders why so much is spent on healthcare every year, it's because you are what you eat.

RickD wrote: ↑Fri Dec 04, 2020 3:26 am Would it make a difference if I told you that virtually every nurse in my hospital will refuse the vaccine?
You wouldn’t wonder why RNs will refuse the vaccine?

It's not unexpected, but it makes me genuinely sad.
These are the people who need the vaccine the most, because they are on the front lines of the battle against covid.

Unfortunately since the beginning of the covid outbreak there has been a deliberate politically motivated misinformation campaign regarding covid-19 in our country.
And people of a certain political persuasion have been vulnerable to these lies and misinformation. And tragically thousands of people in the US have needlessly died because they got sucked into this web of lies and misinformation.

As a pro-life Christian, it breaks my heart to see people embrace and then perpetuate these lies that have resulted in an overwhelming number of preventable deaths.

That said, people on all sides of the political spectrum should embrace the covid vaccines.
- Those who care about their life and those around them should embrace the vaccine as another tool to combat covid-19 and save human lives.
- Those who think covid-19 is an overrated hoax should enthusiastically embrace the incredible, historic results of Operation Warp Speed which has produced 95% effective vaccines in record time that will destroy the China Virus in our country.

DBowling wrote: ↑Fri Dec 04, 2020 10:15 am

RickD wrote: ↑Fri Dec 04, 2020 3:26 am Would it make a difference if I told you that virtually every nurse in my hospital will refuse the vaccine?
You wouldn’t wonder why RNs will refuse the vaccine?

It's not unexpected, but it makes me genuinely sad.
These are the people who need the vaccine the most, because they are on the front lines of the battle against covid.

Unfortunately since the beginning of the covid outbreak there has been a deliberate politically motivated misinformation campaign regarding covid-19 in our country.
And people of a certain political persuasion have been vulnerable to these lies and misinformation. And tragically thousands of people in the US have needlessly died because they got sucked into this web of lies and misinformation.

As a pro-life Christian, it breaks my heart to see people embrace and then perpetuate these lies that have resulted in an overwhelming number of preventable deaths.

That said, people on all sides of the political spectrum should embrace the covid vaccines.
- Those who care about their life and those around them should embrace the vaccine as another tool to combat covid-19 and save human lives.
- Those who think covid-19 is an overrated hoax should enthusiastically embrace the incredible, historic results of Operation Warp Speed which has produced 95% effective vaccines in record time that will destroy the China Virus in our country.

Many of us, including me, in the hospital already test positive for the antibodies. And the vast majority of us never had any symptoms, or minor symptoms. Working in a hospital, we are exposed to all kinds of nasties on a daily basis. And you know what? Being exposed to this stuff, helps us build immunity to this stuff. So no, we don’t need the vaccine. And spouting the rhetoric that we all need the vaccine, won’t change the fact that human beings with healthy immune systems fight off viruses every day without vaccines.

If you want to play Russian roulette with a vaccine needle, that’s your right. But many of us know better.

I'm not here to argue or get personal. But, to me, it's lunacy to NECESSARILY let one's personal distrust of the government push them into distrusting everything and everyone! The anti-vaccine crowd typically ignores that many diseases have been largely eradicated due to them. Mumps, measles, chicken pox, polio, etc. And there are thousands of scientists around the world that have been working on Covid vaccines - many of them Christians and others of high ethical standards. I don't care about opinions of people who are not epidemiologists or that aren't trained and knowledgeable about the development process. That said, I'll take a strong look at what respected scientists can tell us about the safety of specific vaccines. THE reason that so many childhood diseases are no longer a big threat is precisely because of them! I've been vaccinated against mumps, measles and I think I had one for polio when very young. So, the science behind how they work isn't brand new. But that doesn't mean that there aren't concerns about the speed of development. But as long as strict protocols have been followed and I don't see a vocal and substantial number of respected experts raising redflags, then I will take the vaccine!

At some point, we must get the best possible advice from truly qualified people and trust their expertise. Does that mean they can't be wrong in some ways or that the vaccines might not work for some, or might even harm some - of course, there are NO guarantees about anything in life - else I wouldn't get in my car most days. And DB made a great point - even IF one carries Covid but it does little to THEM, well, IT'S NOT ALL ABOUT YOU!!! Because you might well infect a number of people or cause a serious illness (or worse!) to someone else you unknowingly infect. So, why would any responsible person risk that - particularly with the loons who refuse to wear masks or act like there's really nothing to worry about - because they have absolutely no way of knowing what the risk may be, in a given situation. We don't have to - and shouldn't - shut down society. But we don't need to be fools either!

And if the masks and social distancing do nothing whatsoever, how has adopting those practices seriously hurt anyone? But if they ARE effective, as studies assert, then why would I risk the health of myself and others by not doing my part, even if just to be safe (and even if I suspected they might be wrong)? Because those morgues full of bodies aren't a hoax - and they aren't all of old folks and people with serious health conditions - even though, statistically, the odds of dying from Covid show it to be unlikely. But are we saying, some people just will have to risk dying or severe illness because WE don't think it's a big deal - that's prideful and arrogant talk! Again, arguing against what one has no certain knowledge of or expertise in is mere anecdotal hearsay. And will a person refuse protection without having STRONG evidences that it is somehow harmful? Listen, I've had but one flu shot EVER - so I'm not a person who thinks I have to be afraid of every health threat. But do we really have to have some ironclad guarantee that a vaccine will be 100% safe and effective on ourselves? Because life doesn't work like that.

But all that said, I surely am against those who wish to shut society and businesses totally down - as that has it's own terrible ramifications!

We all need to decide for ourselves. We each need to weigh the risks of the virus vs. the vaccine. Right now, after almost a year of having the virus around, we have a really good idea if we are at risk of serious symptoms, by looking at our health. I know that:
1) I have the antibodies for the virus, and I never had a symptom. I don’t get sick, so my immune system must be good.

2) there’s rushed vaccines out there, with no possible way of knowing the long term effects of taking the vaccine.

So, why would I risk my health with a vaccine?

The sad part is that the people with underlying conditions, like smokers, obese, diabetics, etc., want to get the vaccine. But they’re also probably the most at risk for getting “side effects” from the vaccine, because their immune systems suck.

So, the very vaccine they think will help them, could do them more harm.

For those of you who are Christian, and are going to get a vaccine, please make sure it’s not one of the vaccines that were developed using cells from an aborted fetus. There are some that did go that route.

Do a simple google search.

And by the way Philip, there are experts, who are qualified, who are speaking out AGAINST the vaccine. Many specifically for the same reason that I don’t like it. There’s no possible way to know the effects from it. And anyone that assures you that the vaccine is safe, is ignorant or a liar.

Which experts do you listen to? The ones for the vaccine, or against it?

Weigh the pros and cons, and decide for yourselves.

As for me, there’s no way in hell that I’m taking any vaccine without knowing the long term effects.